Donagoness

Its not just that though.

Its the fact that in a decent raid, with decent gear, and a dirge, which are the exact requirements that i said have to be met.

Coercer > Illusionist

BECAUSE

Haste will be capped, double attack will be capped, you will have PoM from coercer, you will have battle cry from a dirge.

therefore a coercers crit bonus and group casting speed gives you something you don't already have capped, therefore giving a bigger benefit than an illusionist.

Hoss

I've never seen my haste get capped. I've never seen it even get soft capped without an illy/troub.

I've also never seen DA capped, but I can see where thats possible at least.

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Donagoness

with set gloves it brings you to 40% Cob is like 65%(?)

Thats already 105% without any group buffs.....

Factoring in stuff like :

Inquisitor Devotion (55%?)

Templar Haste (30%?)

Mystic Haste (not sure all mystics have it, 20%?)

And then there is a belt you can get with 45 stackable haste too, so there is alot of places to get it capped without an illusionist and troubador.

And for Double attack...

Its all over gear peices, you can get potions and temp adorns for it.

Buffs for it from loads of classes.


Crit bonus? not so easy to get

serum321

Illies don't just have PoM, but DR as well.

Hoss

What is the belt with 45 stackable haste?

I admit I never pay attention to what my haste does when cob is up. I'm too busy killing shit at that point. how many mythicaled dirges do you need in order to keep a constant cob rotation for the raid?

The mystic haste is more like 16%, and thats if they take the str line, and if the dog stays alive.

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Donagoness

2 dirges I think if they have the reduced recast on it from RoK set or TSO set.

And destructive rampage is nice I guess, 20 seconds of 10% base damage every 120 seconds.

With the gear I have right now, my stealth attacks are already capped base damage with a dirge, so I guess destructive rampage doesn't mean as much to me as some others. But then again, 5% crit bonus and 15% casting speed > 10% base damage 1/6th of the time.

Jiraya

OKAY
Red: hemo+aa (nodirge/temp) caustis with dirge/ temp
Purple: have some purple up just for frontload
Blue: have some blue up normally ignorant but somrtin else if not generating much hate

Hoss

Pretty close, but coordinate with other scouts in your raid on the purple and blue. If there are no swashies (who get a bonus to turgur) then just make sure someoen is running it.

On the purples, inspect the other scouts and pick one no one else is running. They are good debuffs, but try not to overwrite scouts that have better AA upgrades than you do. Like swashies get upgrades to enfeebling and cerebral, while brigs get upgrades to graceless and warding.

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Jiraya

Thanks all

Davngr

do you raid with a coercer group?

let me kick down some knowlege from someone that always seems to get stuck in the coercer group.. mana becomes an issue. sure im gonna get shit load of *wtf mana is never and issue* but bullshit the coercer myth power consumption reduction has nothing on the illy myth power proc in a dps group. basicly what that means is that if your coecer sucks at keeping tabs on mana you're fucked.

you din't mention destructive rampage that's another 10% base you loose sure if you're rocking avy gearz base is higher but nothing close to 100%. oh and that adds to PoM so illy PoM > coercer PoM

also you can't compare proc haste and DA to constant haste and DA. it's like crit i keep try to stay at 100% crit self buff and let the procs put me well over the thresh hold. most assassin sit around 30% to 40% DA self buffed unless your geared to the teeth.

granted that 5% melee crit bonus for a solid raid assassin is fucking hawt. so IMO it is THE only reason to rock a coercer over an illy and even with the bonus you will find most rading assassins will see about the same dmg as an illy/dirge(this is post gu 52 btw since now DR depending on how much proc gear you has pawns)

i agree with you man it's just that it seems like your trying to say coercer > illy with out the pants even =p

edit. forgot the temp illy INt buff it also brings some nice numbers well.. it's more dmg anyhow lol