Jayad

Yes if you're buffed to >160-170 dps before the proc, you won't get a lot of benefit out of *the dps poirtion*, but you would certainly want the haste portion of it. And you can probably use the STR in most groups. Even if you just get haste and str out of it it's much better on the melee dps.

titanax

I would like to come back to this. All the T6 ancients are Ad3. So is my lvl 35 - Honed Reflexes. All my T7 are mastered out.

How much will it improve to get my ancients mastered? Will it matter with RoK coming soon?

Ardain

I don't know if they said anything yet about the Ancient Teachings being replaced in RoK or not. It's a bit lucky to get them anyway. Still haven't got my "Apply Poison" :/. Finishing Blow is a must-have master imo, but it can be quite expensive.

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† Andira Vendetta - Innovation

Jayad

Finishing Blow is certainly worth upgrading - it's a large dps chunk. I upgraded concealment for the addition de-aggro but it's not important. (However the master is usually cheap so...) With the hate changes it's more important.

It's hard to say with ROK. Who can really tell? They haven't said what they are doing precisely, just a lot of rumors going around.

titanax

Finishing blow is going for 112pp at Blackburrow - pfft so much for buying that!

titanax

I am using the Rallos Zek cloak - should I trade DPS for Haste? I understand that I should as get as many Haste proc & + pierce items as possible.

What would be the ideal value to reach for each component (self not raid)

How about +dps gear. My guildie told me that assassina are big hits type & so dps buffs aren't really necessary.

I was also told me that for group buffs, the priority goes like this:
Ranger > Rogue > Assassin

Agitate is more for a Rouge & IA (apparently we don't need the double attack buff - oh really?) can give to a Ranger 1st & then to a Rogue. His argument is we don't do much damage from auto-attacks & for my auto-attacks to stick I should get my pierce as high as possible. & we come back to my question up top.

So in this regard what group buffs are exclusively beneficial for us? Primal Instinct from a warden? What else? I would like to able to say that I need these buffs too...but I don't have the knowledge to justify it.

Enlighten me pls

Ardain

Well just to tell you my personal point of view:

I'm an ego type of assassin. I want as much buffs as I can get. So I don't really support this "shove those buffs up the rangers' asses cus they are so uberpwnage"-attitude. Rangers are not unbeatable at the top of the parse, not at all. You just need some buff-loving from your group. So make sure no-one tells you you're the last in the line to get buffs. You're TOP DPS, make sure you get the support you deserve! I mean don't bitch for buffs, but there are loads of group buffs you can benefit from, withot taking it away from anyone else. And if you've got an illu, there should be no question that you get haste. If you've got a coercer, no way you don't get a DPS buff.

As far as I can tell autoattack is more important for rangers and rogues than for us assassins. I don't say it's NOT important for us, but I think it makes a bigger portion of DPS for them. I don't play a ranger and only have a lvl 50 brigand, so correct me if I'm wrong, please. So, a haste and DPS buff might be better on a ranger or a rogue but we certainly benefit from it as well. I don't know about double attack, why shouldn't we benefit from it? As far as I know we're the only scout class that doesn't have double attack at all from AAs?
Best thing to avoid losing buffs to a ranger or rogue: Don't be in the same group as they are. Try to be in OT group or MT group if you've got a berserker tanking (always prefer the bers to be with you to the guardian). It's really all about group setup. I usually< end up in a group that's usually melee DPS but can act as an OT group if needed as well.

I don't know what the buffs names are, but as far as I can remember without logging into the game there are:

Dirge:
+all crits 7.5% (group)
+dps (group)
+melleeskills (group)
+str etc (group)
cacophony

Illusionist:
+haste (single)
+double attack 25% (single)
short term int buff (group)
short term fast reuse and cast (group)
...

Fury:
+int and power (single)
agitate (single) yay! ;)

Berserker:
+str
rage (?)
...

Inquisitor:
fanatism
...

Templar:
+str and wis (single)

Coercer:
+dps (single)

Warden:
+melleskills (single)

Defiler/Mystic:
Symbol of Alacrity (short time buff for faster refresh AA)
...

Troub:
+double attack +10% (group)
--> don't know the other ones cus I rarely have a troub


I'm sure i forgot quite a few things, but I'm not logged in and just came home from being out ;). So feel free to add things (and spellnames).

Selfbuffed I have 27ish haste (belt adorn and cloak) and 85ish dps (mostly adornments and selfbuff).

Hope this is not too confusing and nothing is pure bullshit, you understand my weird english and I got all the names right (this time) .

X
Dai

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† Andira Vendetta - Innovation

Jayad

Buffs should go on the people that make the most use of them, whether it's rangers, rogues or assassins. The idea that certain buffs are for certain classes is nutty. I'll certainly do more with IA than a shitty or even average ranger. A really good ranger can probably do more with it, by a little.

It's really a problem with the game where people understand how things work only in general terms. Yeah, rogues do damage with "auto-attack", but that doesn't mean they should get IA. That's because many of them are specced for double attack and procs. So of course the damage will show up as auto-attack. People's lack of understanding of the mechanics will make them think that. For example, 8% of ranger's auto-attack is their personal double attack. IA won't boost that portion of it. You have to get to the base number to see how much more IA will add. Same with rogues with 1H and double attack AA. When you take out their AA bonuses it's often not as different as people think, as to which it would add more to. Few people could even tell you the difference because there's certain assumptions about buffing. The top guilds put IA on their ranger (if they have one), so it must be smart! Heh.

It can be pretty complicated but the basic rule to me is buffs are the most effective on the better player(s). If somebody in my guild can do more with it than me, then they should have it. If I can do more, it should be on me. If we're about the same, then maybe you can be on rotation for it or something.

Plus I think people (including myself) are often focused on particular stuff too much. You can get some pretty good combination of things. I never get IA, since we have one illusionist and a ranger, and I'm usually in MT. It used to bother me, but now I don't really care. I usually have a zerker and dirge and often a coercer. That's just about as good, so screw it.

Vaanir

Totally agree there.
I'll post some parses with and without IA to see what difference it makes for us (Can check other forums for other classes maybe), tomorrow or something, though i doubt they will mean much, since group/raid/zone will be different ...... =/

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Vaanir

titanax

Yeah it pretty much comes to this - only the better players get the buffs...so if you're learning your class like me then I get the buffs last..(but hey when I started this post I was doing 600 - now I'm averaging 2k on a shitty group setup - so there :D) I don;t really care about group buffs coz well if you're in the group you get it. Its the single friend buffs that I'm missing out on.

What irks me is when they compare DPS its not fair coz the other assassin outparses me by 1k (MT group)

Yeah that would be awesome...right now I'm getting Ferin VIM most of the time & my Conjie gives me Ember Seed when he can