Go Back   EQ2Flames Forum > Class Discussion > Brigands

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 05-12-2008, 08:59 PM  
Regular
 
Rhymez's Avatar
 
Character: Zauriel
Guild: Unity
Server: Splitpaw

Posts: 649
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

but im not sacrificing a lot of crit and da gear to increase my ca mod by a lot
as the cas im using a lot would be capped at like 400 to 500 already
the cas we are talkin that would get a increase are on 30sec to 1min timers

and the dot component of entrail and spew dont get a huge increase at all even thought entrail is high on my parse list
__________________

Q : This is the afterlife and Im god.

Picard : No Im not dead as I refuse to believe the
afterlife is run by you , the Universe is not so badly designed.



Last edited by Rhymez; 05-12-2008 at 09:07 PM.
Rhymez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2008, 09:35 PM  
Self-Proclaimed Baller
 
Paperclip's Avatar
 
Character: Paperclip
Guild: Paradise Lost
Server: Oasis

Posts: 303
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

Putting Dispatch on a timer?! Who would do such a thing?! Sir, I call your bluff!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trumak View Post
See but I like arguing and getting a rise out of people. You are just a peasant, and I will shit on your life.


Leader of Paradise Lost
Oasis Server
http://eq2paradiselost.guildportal.com
Paperclip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2008, 09:46 PM  
Regular
 
Character: Lyasa
Guild: KotS
Server: Butcherblock

Posts: 238
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

just make sure you have a 2nd brigand in raid and you hit your hotkey same time as they hit theirs, problem solved. i'm sure someone can figure out how to automate that so you don't even need to be at the keyboard and instead be on the beach enjoying coronas or mai-tais or whatever frufru drink people like at the beach.

dunno about yours, but my rob does about 1500 damage before +CA so that's don't cap out till 750ish, works out to another 25 dps over having just 500 +ca. just sayin.

Last edited by lyasa; 05-12-2008 at 09:51 PM.
lyasa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2008, 02:08 PM  
Self-Proclaimed Baller
 
Paperclip's Avatar
 
Character: Paperclip
Guild: Paradise Lost
Server: Oasis

Posts: 303
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

Coco Locos are uber. Royal Caribbean's private island (I think its called Cocokay) has random servants walking around offering Coco Locos. It has like 14 different rums in this fruit punch slushy mix.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trumak View Post
See but I like arguing and getting a rise out of people. You are just a peasant, and I will shit on your life.


Leader of Paradise Lost
Oasis Server
http://eq2paradiselost.guildportal.com
Paperclip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2008, 12:34 PM  
Visitor
 
Character: Azrrael
Guild: Brigands Rule
Server: Blackburrow

Posts: 11
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

Just saw this post, have some free time so here we go

Thought I would show some simple math to help clarify some things...I am going to compare a toon with 100% crit and 0% DA vs a toon with 0% crit and 100% DA.

IMPORTANT NOTE: None of the below calculations factor in buffs and debuffs!!!! This is ok b/c I'll still get my point across to everyone.

Looking at Auto-Attack first and using only one weapon:

Given:
One Self Buffed Bad Mofo Brigand with an Actual Dmg Range = 293 - 1174
so on average with 0% crit and 0% DA your AA will hit for the median in this range which is 734.

At 100% crit and 0% DA

When you crit your AA will do 1175 so your gain is the crit value minus your average hit without crit which is 1175 - 734 = 441. At 100% crit you will gain 441 more damage on each swing because you are crit'ing every swing. This means that 1% crit = 441 * 0.01 = 4.41 per crit

At 100% DA and 0% crit

If you are DA'ing every swing, your gain on average will be twice that of your original median or 732 * 2 = 1464 (note: your range has doubled with 100% DA, so it is now 586 - 2348 w/ median being 1467...yes i know there is a slight difference in 1464 and 1467 due to rounding errors and the plus 1 to max damage used in the crit calculation)

With your average AA damage with 100% DA being at 1467, your gain is the DA average minus your normal median or 1467 - 734 = 733. This means that with 100% DA you will gain on average 733 damage per swing. So 1% DA will gain you 733 * 0.01 = 7.33 per DA


Comparing The Two:

1% crit gains you 4.41 extra damage on average
1% DA gains you 7.33 extra damage on average
So with AA only, 1% DA does 7.33 - 4.41 = 2.92 more damage on average per swing than 1% crit.


WTF Az?!?! I thought crit > DA ??? Crit is > DA overall. Remember we are just looking at self buffed Auto-Attacking without buffs and debuffs. Buffs and Debuffs do not really matter that much with AA'ing because they will benefit DA and crit about the same (if you don't believe me, crunch the numbers yourself)


Why is Crit > DA ??

Crit affects both Auto-Attacking at CA damage while DA only affects Auto-Attacking. When you add in the crit benefits of CA damage, 1% crit will be more than 4.41. Also crit benefits more from buffs and debuffs due to the added benefits of CA damage.


How much benefit do CA's get from crit ?

We are going to take another simple approach to this mainly because I can get my point across without heavier math, and this is the toughest part of the equation to figure out. Why? Because it is so buff and debuff dependant. This math does NOT include buffs and debuffs!!! Also for this math I have to assume some things, but IT'S OK!!

With 100% crit:

In excel, I recorded the min and max damages of every CA I have (dot ticks included and double up excluded). Then I ASSUMED that when I attack something, I will cycle through all my CA's once and the dots will tick once. I did not use any CA twice, so every CA is weighted equally even though this isnt the case in an actual raid. Some CA's are used more than others (duh!).

Then I multipled every MAX DMG of every CA by 30%***(see the reference below as to why I did this) b/c I am at 100% crit so everything is going to crit and my gain will be 30% more than the MAX DMG. I then took the average of all the MAX DMG * 0.3 values and came up with ~463. So at 100% crit with the ASSUMPTIONS above, I will on average do 463 more damage with every CA. This means that 1% crit will do on average 463 * 0.01 = 4.63. With buffs/debuffs this value would be a higher value and not so conservative.

Putting all this simplified math together:

This is what we have calculated with the given dmg range...

1% crit AA gain = 4.41
1% DA AA gain = 7.33
1% crit average gain per CA = 4.63

Looking at a Combat Art & AA Interval:

In this Combat Art Interval we are going to cast 3 CAs then AA once. Sorry for this crappie format of the interval but this post keeps reformating what I want.......

The sequence of numbers will represent CA1, CA2, CA3, AA and then the Sum of these damages.

with 100% crit your damage gain would be:

4.63 + 4.63 + 4.63 + 4.41 = 18.3

with 100% DA your damage gain would be:

0 + 0 + 0 + 7.33 = 7.33


I hope everyone can form the conclusion of this post by themselves. Time to LOG IN and play some eq2. Hope this helps some of ya grasp the concepts of crit and DA. If not, flame me all ya want.


Az



***If youre into math and wanna see why CA crits oddly follow the straight MAX DMG * 1.3 rule, then go to this link:
Now with Weapon DR calculation!: Critical Damage and You.. A guide to critical damage.
Azrrael is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2008, 01:01 PM  
Visitor
 
Character: Azrrael
Guild: Brigands Rule
Server: Blackburrow

Posts: 11
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

Oops...I messed up on my simplified CA damage calc. But if you followed the post up to that point, I'm sure you can see where I farted and underestimated the damage gain of CAs with each crit.

Az
Azrrael is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2008, 11:11 PM  
Regular
 
Character: Vane (Assassin)
Guild: Faceless
Server: Ahriman (AoC)

Posts: 167
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

Assume a brigand has 0 MC and 0 DA.

Assume his DPS consists of 35% autoattack, 55% CA's and 10% INT based damage.

Assume his weapons both have the ideal (with current weapon selection) 1:5.75 min:max ratio.

1 DA gives a 0.35% DPS boost (0.01 * 35)
1 MC gives a 0.43% DPS boost (0.01 * 35 * 0.77 + 0.01 * 55 * 0.3)

For simplicity, I didnt factor in +CA not benefitting from crits (which lessens the value of crits).
__________________
Chik, (retired) troubador on Splitpaw
Chix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2008, 05:01 PM  
Regular
 
Character: Lyasa
Guild: KotS
Server: Butcherblock

Posts: 238
Photos: (0)

Default Re: crit > doubleattack > +ca dmg

14 kinds? sounds like i got an island to visit, or at least a recipe to find and a ton of rum to buy.
lyasa is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On


Sponsor Ads


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:32 AM.


Design By: Miner Skinz.com Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.1.0