Lorant

A few questions about Charming...

First, I am assuming that level of mob affects it's resist % and breaking % on each check? So best to get an even con?

Second, does Master level really make that much of a difference? I went from App 1 to Adept 1 last night on my level 10 Charm and saw no difference in resists and breaking. 1 min, broken. 2 mins, broken. 3 resists in a row. I've got him to level 14 but can't continue like this if I can't even get TO the mobs from the quest giver if I have to re-charm twice in 5 minutes. If a Master level can cut resists and breaking to negligible or even acceptable, I would love it.

Also, some random coercer I ran into who was starting out too says he picked the class due to hearing that we can pull some ridiculous junk out of our asses later in regards to soloing mobs or God himself. Just trash talk and rumor? Cuz what I read here isn't inspiring much

Btw, the melee line of AA, any good? I like the LoTRO and Vanguard types that cast and use staves pretty well. Possible here?

Thanks, appreciate any input.

Jhoram

Even con -> yellow con works fine... once you start putting points into the Charm AA and into WIS for extra subjugation, and get your Master charm, you can go higher. It gets SO much better, trust me. At 80, the pets i charm are almost as reliable as summoner pets (they dont break unless I want them to)

Coercers are the most reliable/powerful/able soloers of ^^^ named heroics. We're not the fastest (unless we have a mage pet), but we can pull off some stuff most other classes can't.

A lot of the negative stuff you hear about coercers is with regards to raid utility/dps. Most coercers will acknowledge that we're pretty damn good soloers.

The melee line for coercers is more supplementary than anything. I only used it for a little while, and found myself not bothering to melee since it was just easier to let the pet beat on mobs and use reactives. If you want a good melee caster, i suggest you look at one of the melee priests. Inquisitors, Wardens and Mystics can turn themselves into pretty decent meleeing debuffing healing guys.

Lorant

Thanks for the quickness. Your level 80 comment makes me smile, been hearing those type of things for 9 years now No offense, but I want the ride TO 80 to be fun as hell, not just when I finally get there. I quit my Bruiser at 54 over a year ago, so coming back to new expansions and AA, trying something new out.

Now, since it'll take time to get AA's for Charm and WIS, will just the Master Charm help a lot on resists and breaking? I'm not too worried about charming reds right now, I just want lower cons to stop breaking all the fucking time too.

Was mostly just curious about the melee caster. I grew up as a 65 RAnger in EQ1 thru Rangers in some form in everything from AC to AO to Horizons to WoW's Hunter. Took the Vanguard PSI and LoTRO caster types to try out. I've never played a shaman, so may take a Mystic for a spin and see. Thanks.


Appreciate you offsetting the whinig, it's always negative on forums. I'll keep at it and get a Master charm somehow.

Jhoram

Don't worry, it gets better a lot faster than 80. After 24 life becomes easier, by the time you're 45 it's a total breeze. Remember to charm caster or priest mobs for the best damage. There's descriptions about how to solo mobs on both boards if you really need to be told, but its always more fun to figure it out yourself ;)

Lorant

Aye, I skimmed a guide and the only thing new for me was a command to force a pet to use ranged. I need to make a macro, but I always prefer my little quirks. You try duoing with another Ranger in the first few years of EQ1 and tell me one guide can explain that mess!

Hatcher

The master charm is a MUST! Makes all the difference in the world when it comes to damage. The mobs hit/nuke much harder with a master version of the spell.

Senelin

As for resists breaks, basically all I can say is that's why you get a mez. At low levels charm is not reliable in any way shape or form. It's not really until you get into the 30s that you can count on your pet to not break within 5 minutes. And even then it just may do that. If you find that you're getting extensively frustrated with charmed pets, try going without them. It works, it's a lot safer, and then you can slowly work the charmed pet back in at the pace you feel comfortable.

The point at low levels is that you *can't* rely on your charm to get you through, so bear that in mind as you go.

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Lorant

Hit 20 and the Adept 3 Coerce still breaking an assload. Got 5 in Charm, 1 in Mana Flow, and 4 in the first WIS. Full pristine cloth, the +10 WIS/+10 INT stuff all over, and a similar masterwork staff.

Getting frustrated. I like the class, going to stick with it, but blue cons breaking after 1 min is just killing me.

Still looking for a Master Charm or Coerce on Lucan, if anyone knows anyone.

- Harmilan (Lorant is my bruiser)

Hesster

Low levels are hard on coercers, probably the hardest out of any class. Expect to die a lot, because even when charm lasts full duration it's still pretty short, and at low levels you don't have enough stuns and mezzes to effectively deal when it does. Once you hit mid 30s and get Beguile and your group stuns/mezzes, your survivability will increase dramatically.

Until then, look for items that increase subjugation, even if you have to use stuff that's gray or take a hit on other stats. Get a mount if you don't have one already, and try to hunt near zone lines or in open areas where you can run your squishy ass away without drawing a lot of aggro if charm breaks at an inopportune moment. Until you get your long duration stuns, it's generally not worth trying to recharm your ex-pet if it breaks mid fight. Just use the 3 second mez you get when it breaks to put as much distance between you and the mobs as possible.

Xavion

Ok, first off, what the guy meant by the WIS line was the buff that increases your subjugation. The first 4 points in the WIS line is just filling up your WIS, which is useless for Coercers. Subjugation is the stat you need to care more about than anything, and not just for the charms- stuns, mezzes, roots, basically all control spells fall under subjugation. On the wis line, it's like the third or fourth slot down, so you need to get a lot more AA before you can get to that one. Get subj maxed and then some. =)

Second, I have a theory which has never really been proven to be true or false, so here it is: The longer your charm lasts, the greater the chance at breaking. Now, I know it doesn't read that way on the spell description, but it sure seems to me that this is how it works. Once you level you'll see what I mean... with higher subj and adept III or Master charm, it rarely happens, and usually only when it's been up for close to the duration of the spell. (and by the way, each upgrade last a few minutes more than the previous version, so don't worry, it's not going to be a ten minute timer forever). =)

It is very true that we can do a lot of things other classes cannot, and solo like champs. The key with this class on most big fights is patience, and the proper usage of your spells. Learn what each one does well, and get a good routine down that you are comfortable with.

The biggest and most common mistake people make when they give up on Coercer is assuming that the class is the same at level 20 or 30 as it is later on at 60 or 70. This is very far from true. I laugh when people tell me they had a coercer at 30-something and re-rolled that toon, because they have no idea what a great toon they could have had, one that can do things and go places many cannot. And valuable too... don't know how many tells I get when I log in to take a group through Vaults or Maiden's Chamber in Jarsath Wastes (the devs' lone gift to us in the latest expansion... a mezzer- preferably a coercer from most people I talk to- is damn near a must have in those zones).

So, don't make the mistake of giving up too early. Heck I almost did in the first months of the game's release...grinding through the thirties, I made another couple toons, played them for months, got a wild hair to go back and attempt to level the coercer, made it to 40 and began to realize this class wasn't so bad. Then at 50 I was loving it, soloing the nameds to the FBSS HQ and completing other HQ's all on my own. After that, I never looked back and Xavion stayed my main toon. He is 80 now, but off and on I have made other toons on a whim just to learn more about other classes. I now have tons of alts, including a 75 SK and a 71 fury, both who are great to play, but I still always have more fun on the Coercer.

Ok my bad for so long a reply, I'm bored at work.

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Alts = What you do in your spare time
Spare Time = The time in your life that is not spent playing your main
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