GU37 changes on Test

Orodina · 07-20-2007, 04:01 PM

for Coercer AAs:

Enhance: Dispel Magic: Improves casting and reuse speed as well.
Thought Snap: Improved reuse speed from 3 minutes to 90 seconds.
Tashiana: Increased duration from 10 to 13 seconds.
Coercive Healing: No longer increases power cost of heals.

Dispel Magic: Does Lockeye like playing with broken doorknobs and other useless things too? Dispel Magic does nothing in PvE. The enhanced version that coercers get does double that (i.e. nothing). Changing the casting speed and reuse speed isn't going to suddenly make it useful.

Thought Snap: For those who need it, a short recast means that you get to use an ability that gets resisted like crazy even more often. Fun!

Tashiana: Kinda non-plussed. will be able to get in one, maybe two more spells in that time.

Coercive Healing: Mystics have a harder time keeping power up than defilers, so this is handy if you have a mystic rather than a defiler in the group.

All in all nothing to get excited about.

Orodina · 07-20-2007, 05:19 PM

Oh, missed the part about aggro changes. Looks like Lockeye decided to put them back in the end:

Modified effectiveness on certain hate increase/reduction/transfer abilities on scout classes and coercers. This makes all achievements that modify hate more worthwhile, and places slightly more responsibility on predators/rogues in controlling their aggro generation.

Assassin - Shadows: Reduced percentage
Ranger - Reconnoiter: Reduced percentage
Swashbuckler - Swarthy Distraction: Reduced percentage
Brigand - Confound Adversaries: Increased trigger percentage. Doubled hate reduction amount, but removed hate position decrease.
Dirge - Hyran's Angry Sonata: Lower level bonuses are higher than before, but its highest level upgrade bonuses are slightly reduced.
Troubador - Alin's Serene Serenade: Its highest level upgrade bonuses are reduced by 3%.
Coercer - Smirking Demeanor: Reduced hate increase component, but added a hate transfer component. This allows it provide additional hate transfer bonuses, even when the hate increase percentage cap is reached.

So odds are we are back to the 17% hate add/17% hate transfer that was on Test in GU36 testing. I guess we will see if they stay in this time or not.

Duress · 07-20-2007, 05:22 PM

Did you miss this part?

Modified effectiveness on certain hate increase/reduction/transfer abilities on scout classes and coercers. This makes all achievements that modify hate more worthwhile, and places slightly more responsibility on predators/rogues in controlling their aggro generation.

Assassin - Shadows: Reduced percentage
Ranger - Reconnoiter: Reduced percentage
Swashbuckler - Swarthy Distraction: Reduced percentage
Brigand - Confound Adversaries: Increased trigger percentage. Doubled hate reduction amount, but removed hate position decrease.
Dirge - Hyran's Angry Sonata: Lower level bonuses are higher than before, but its highest level upgrade bonuses are slightly reduced.
Troubador - Alin's Serene Serenade: Its highest level upgrade bonuses are reduced by 3%.
Coercer - Smirking Demeanor: Reduced hate increase component, but added a hate transfer component. This allows it provide additional hate transfer bonuses, even when the hate increase percentage cap is reached.

Player on test confirmed M1 Enraging Demeanor will be 17/17 as it was when they first suggested this change.

The scouts in my guild are bitching up a storm, but I actually rather like the change. Does that make me crazy? =(

Revel · 07-20-2007, 05:25 PM

Don't forget the hate changes, Freyaldo already pointed them out. Here's a quick screen:

Cyllie · 07-20-2007, 05:52 PM

Thought Snap: well its a benifit, but this ability isn't usually needed that often so I really can't see it making that much of a difference. I really would like to see the fix the bugs with this spell. In Emerald Halls when you cast it and the mob gets sent to a tank not engaged in combat the whole fucking encounter will reset...only zone I have seen this happen in both on Prince and on the rumbler, after seeing this I won't even use it the zone as about the only time I need it, unless someone is an idiot on a memwipe mob, is to send the encounter back to the tank after they died.

Enhance Dispel Magic: I just feel like I have been shit on here

Tashiana: Is there something I am missing here, don't we get enough mental debuffs as is, especially if you have an INT spec? I played with this a bit, but it really doesn't make that big of a difference, I guess having your own private dispatch is nifty and all, but it really doesnt do a whole lot...without it my spells rarely get resisted, with it they rarely get resisted, and my spells crit for about the same as long as I use my normal mental debuffs first... A couple mobs with insane mental resists I have seen it useful on, but even then you got to get it to land first. I can see maybe soloing using it to make doubly sure you don't get resisted, but really I don't solo much anymore myself except to farm now and then and I really in no way need this.

Coercive Healing: nice they got rid of the power increase....now all that needs to be done is to make it a group buff so its actually a bit more useful...it does boost wards more then upgrading from adept 3 to master though

I really have mixed emotions with the hate transfer change, the only way it can be any kind of use is if you are fully specced for dps, even then I don't know if the little 17% transfer is going to be worth losing over 30% gain

I know.....how about getting rid of all three of these AA abilities and giving us more useful ones that I don't have to rack my brain to invent uses for.

Celui · 07-22-2007, 03:38 PM

enchance dispel magic ... lol....
Thought snap ... Way to waste 21 AAs.. This is really only needed for guilds with crap tanks.
Tashiana ... Wow leet. 3 seconds more. The resistability on this spell should be 99% harder.
Coercive Healing ... Great. Now if the amounts were changed to regeneration 30%, Reactives trigger count +2, wards +20% we might have a buff as useful as TC or Illusory arm

Hate Changes ... Uhhh. I guess they did this so a dirge and coercer can run hate on the tank? Except that the way it is now a dirge can run hate on the swashy/assassin and coercer runs hate on tank so the swashy/assassin transfers way more hate to the tank thru dmg. I'd rather it stay the way it is now but add a hate transfer component if the target of the spell is an NPC, I.E a charmed pet.

Manyak · 07-22-2007, 06:49 PM

And this is how coercers become completely disposable.

Raethe · 07-23-2007, 12:59 PM

My thoughts on the current hate changes for coercers are two-sided; I really do like the idea that the transfer puts more control into our hands as far as stun-agro and burst reactive agro happens - the more stuff we do, the more hate gets to the right person, instead of just a passive hate gain for the tank.

However, I am conflicted on how this transfer will work with the STA AA Empathic Soothing - 8 points into that decreases the Hate Gain of group members (AE) by 8.0% if the member is not a fighter.

How will this stack overall, will the hate transfer happen prior to the hate decrease from ES, or after, or conflict and break the whole thing? I would love to know one way or the other, I've been considering changing my AA setup for sometime now anyway.

Revel · 07-23-2007, 01:05 PM

Well, other guilds have employed a hate increase on their hate transfer (swash/assassin) and those guilds report that it seems to have increased the hate gain through transfer. (If it were calculated after the transfer, the swash/assassin would surely get aggro all the time, so this is the only way that the outcame makes sense). So, my guess is that hate decrease would also be calculated before the transfer, thus empathic soothing in its current state would decrease the amount of hate we transferred.

Other hate decreasers would also hurt us then, if this was the mechanic that was used.

Manyak · 07-23-2007, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raethe

However, I am conflicted on how this transfer will work with the STA AA Empathic Soothing - 8 points into that decreases the Hate Gain of group members (AE) by 8.0% if the member is not a fighter.

Cast empathic soothing, and then cancel it from the spell effects window (the one with all the group's buffs). It will stay in effect on everyone but yourself.

As far as the mechanics, yes Revel is right. The straight hate increasers/decreasers get applied first, and then the transfers. However, the entire system breaks when one person has 2 transfers on them (Amends). If you cast a hate transfer on a paladin who has amends on you, then neither transfer will work. If you want to test this for urself, try it with a wizzie - they have a 4% agrro transfer. If they put this transfer up on the paladin, it should benefit him by giving him more of a transfer than just amends alone. But instead, you will find that the pally won't be able to hold aggro for shit.