Originally Posted by Giralus

Shadowknights Use DPS for Agro
Shadowknights have Tuant over time and a Bunch of Dots
Shadowkinghts cast Spells, that get interupted = no damage= no agro and lower dps
Shadowknights in Defensive have Crap DPS and Crap agro and Crap Survivability
Shadowknights cannot take prolonged beatings from heavy hitting mobs becuase they have no way to absorb the damage (Bloodletter helps but IMO there should be 2 charges on the Spell)

an SK takes Longer to Build agro , but cant Last as long agaisnt the same incoming damage but the fight will take longer becuase sk takes longer to lock agro and so the sk has to take even more damage = do the math .

i usualy OT for our guild , but when our Normal Guardian MT cannot attend a raid i MT , and certain names that the Guardian can Tank with 2 healers i cannot Tank with 3 healers. i also cannot lock agro down on Single mobs like a guardian so the Raid has to Ease into Dps and be more careful not to Rip agro and that means it will take even longer to kil the same Name using an SK

i think Soe is absolutly retarded with what they did with ROk making Guardians the 1 Primary Tank in the Game , if the Guardian is not able to make Raid then 23 other people can't Progress any farther in that raid.

Sure when a Shadowknight is Completely decked out in the absolute best gear they can get in the game and is 100 % mastererd they will be able to Tank almost anything in the game, but how many Shadowknights will get to that point befor an expansion or a level increase ? and by the there guardians will aslo be fully decked out and still be much easier to use as MT

what is the trade of for shadowknights for the reason they do not tank equaly as Guardians and do less Dps ? Evac ? you must be kidding me

its a short sighted view by SOE that they viewed the statistics and saw that Most raid guild use guardians as MT(and they couldnt figure out that isnt becuase people just Love guardians , but becuase the Guardians is just the Easiest MT to use for MT ) instead of having 4 tanks that could fill the MT or OT position , we have 1 Tank that is hands down MT and 4 tanks fighting over just the OT position, and Paladin is Hands down the best OT in the game , so realy there is no arguement Guard MT pally OT and Sk's get Evac and Zerkers get to twiddle there thumbs.



its pretty simple for Soe to Increase Sk's survivablity , they just need to add 1 charge back onto Bloodletter so the Skill has 2 charges(people cried overpowered in Beta of ROk and so it went live with just 1 charge ,, i dont think they feel the same way now when we see how hard Epics are hitting : ) and add into our Offensive stance if we are 2 Handed all our Damage will be increased by XX % to bring up our damage that is lacking in ROk , Agro all they need to do is increase our Syphon Hate AA to be 8 % of groups hate so it will be more equal with Amends , Defensive stance should atleast have the widom increase changed to Aviodance , and Agression Should be increased highley to make up for the Seriuos drop in DPS(the way SK's hold agro ) and proper itemization for SK's (Spell and CA increases) and Increased Damage on 2 Handeed weopons in ROK+ add in some +parry or +Defense on some 2 Handers


meh i have played an Sk since release and i don't expect any love from soe, its plain as day to everyone playing eq2 that sk's have issue's in rok , but its 5 months into expansion and not a peep



You can cry till the day is done that Guardians are suppose to be the Raid MT of eq2, but i have played since release and have seen the Dev's state Many many times " all tanks will Tank Equaly but by Different methods" and as a Point Shadowknights Tank NOTHING like a Guardian at ALL... the problem is they Dont take Diffrently and Equaly they tank diffrently and Not equaly , not equal in survivabilty, not equal in Agro and not equal in DPS ... so give it up ,

SK's dont need Fuck for Utility , we arent a Utility Class, we are a PLATE TANK . and need Minor Tweaks to Balance use out to be Equal but Diffrent.

Originally Posted by guapo1

by giralus.


Read your manual guardians are supposed to be the better tank it was there origional design as far as raids.While the rest of you are better group tanks off tanks. It is not just becuase of rok get of your rocker.
We where designed to be the better raid tank while the rest of you where better group tanks. This is the way we where designed to be and it is not that way just since rok.

by giralus.

You keep haveing this assumption tank equally as in raid tanking you are sadly again mistaken. equally capable of group yes but if equal for raids bs.Guardian is specifically designed for one thing only takeing the most dmg and holding agro thats why we have higher hp and defense.Sk and paladins are a hybrid class you are supposed to be in between zerkers and guardians dps.Defense values soe has set in order of guard zerker pally sk .Dps zerker sk paladin guard.

sk and paladins are a hybrid class they unlike a guardian was not specifically designed to just tank you have spell ability heal ability and zerkers higher dps. What do guardians have ,and what where they designed for. We have higher hp and defensive skills with a few more tuants that are in no way near in comparision to an sk paladin or a zerkers. We do well on single targets where you all excel better on ae.


You want equalality k np you can have our defensive ability give guardians lay on hands and death march.Guardians are a easy tank class to play try fucking playing one.You want tank as good as a guardian to mt raid then fucking roll one.Soe has screwed up your class with rok not debateing that.However to think you should have dw and the same defense as a guardian and a higher dps.Why not just tell soe to delete guardians period then.Becuase then there no sense for our class period.


You want to be best at tanking then roll a guardian you choice to play an sk knowing that you where not the high end tank type. Dont give me this bull shit soe said all tanks shall be equal.This debate not even worth conversing anymore your just getting even more retarded now.

Originally Posted by Giralus

Shadowknights have tanked just about every Raid mob in the game, and eventualy will tank everyhing in ROk, the issue is that befor rok the differance wasnt as Large between Sk and Guardian Tanking, and yes even befor Rok Shadowknights were very gear dependant. the trade off befor was that SK out dps guards on Multiple and Single target encounters , they did more dps so therefore they werent able to take as much damage ,, Kil the mob Quicker and you wouldnt need to take as much damage so it almost evens out , now the mobs in Rok hit like trucks, and guardians are out parsing Sk's..Trash mobs in rok can be ot by zerkers paladins and sks only names cant.Trash mobs do not hit any ware near as hard as the names you can not tank currently.

solo and group play has nothing to do with Raiding, but lets take what you said " Guards and Shadowknights are Equal in Group tanking, and guards are better Raid tanks, so whats the trade off for Sk ?
I never said anything of the sort i said sk zerker and paladins are better group tanks and have always been.Your classes are not dependent on group set ups like that of a guardian,again dont put words in my mouth.
i never asked for Dual wield , actualy im totaly against it, and i personaly dont feel the Guardian Mythical is over powered, i think the other Plate tanks Mythicals are lack luster and need to be Class specific as the guards. Did not say you did, refered to deules coment on that sks should

i also said that Sk's arent Broken, and need some minor adjustments to bring them back closer to equality. Sk's in rok are not where they should be, normaly there jack of all trades master of non, but currently there the jack of all trades and underpowered at them all. i Said that sks need work on utility and dps.You said all fighters should have equality tanking.

i also didnt ask for guardians to be nerfed, but i have asked for Sk's to be raised up to equal ground , all 4 plate tanks are Tanks, and this isn't eq1 so hybrids my asshole. i dont mind if guardians can take damage 10 % better, but in that case an SK should have 5 % better agro and 5 % better DPS , the 2 things needed to Tank are Ability to take damage, ability to grab, maintian,and get back agro if ever lost. Sk's cant take equal damage, they dont have snap agro, they can maintain agro if allowed to build it, but if agro is lost sk's can have a rough time getting it back(espeicaly if rescue or ht or death march are down becuase in Rok usualy any one of them alone will not get agro back. Same with guardians rescue and reinforcement at times.
you also say Play a Guard and see how easy it is " i do play a guard, i never said it was easy, it is Diffrent(and thats exactly what it is suppose to be,,,, but its not equal to an SK ) and in turn i say " Play an SK and see and feel the differance between them. Why would i want to play an sk when i wanted to be an important role in the game mechanics, raids.Eq1 was same way warrior was not a needed class till end game content.i have played guard since eq2 was released it was same way not much of use till later on in end game.When i was lvling my guard and is same way now in early lvls.Groups didnt want guardian they wanted paladin sk or zerkers.

i also play an Inquisitor, so i know the differances in healing an SK vs a Guardian. so we can discuss that next if you like from a Healers point of view.

Originally Posted by Ower

SK:s should be the top fighter on agro. if you follow the lore that is. They have better tools for that now aswell. ppl that are posting here are forgetting that shit they got a epic weapon aswell. That helps the SK to take spike damage and have some nice hate gain on it. So it helps the SK ALOT imo.

Originally Posted by Kaylee

SK Mythical does absolutley shit for our survivability. For 8 Seconds every 6 minutes we can't get one shotted, nice, So now all I need is divine guidance to tell me exactly when that mob is going to 1 shot me.