Anjin

What exactly are you trying to say? Your avoidance sucks? Monks avoidance sucks? Are you a Pally or guardian? What gear do you have? Who had avoidance on you? What was the split on the ACT avoidance report?

jfantasy

Avoidance from skill can't work well on avatar(high level mob) is what i want to say. I am a pally.

Anjin

Monks can get 50%+ uncontested avoidance without Tsunami.

Brawler chest, hat & another = 13% uncontested
Supple Dogwood Staff = 15% uncontested
Wrist adornments = 6% uncontested
Def Stance = 16%
= 50%

This is without other items that provide uncontested avoidance (probably available to both classes). I doubt a paladin could achieve that.

Also, this really limits a Paladin to using a shield at all times - even when DPSing. Whereas even if a monk goes to mid stance to DPS, they'll only reduce the uncontested avoidance by 8%, or go down to 34% uncontested if they use offensive stance.

As far as Tsunami is concerned, if the MT goes down and I pull aggro, popping Tsunami stops autoattacks hitting for 12 secs, which is pretty uncontested to me

Anjin

Any avoidance is better than no avoidance and monks provide more avoidance than paladins.

jfantasy

would a monk lower their dps with these gears with defense stance? a pally only need to take their shield and use offense stance. A good shield can provide 30~35% block.

Anjin

I'll be able to do decent dps with those items in mid stance. Even if I went to offensive stance the avoidance would still be 34%+, leaving aside the uncontested avoidance which would benefit the tank when the mob is debuffed.

Remember that your DPS will be gimped because you're stuck with a shield in your offhand instead of wielding a 2h.

Don't know what the fuss is about tbh, your aa ability only provides 24% more shield effectiveness = 4.8 extra block with a shield giving 20 block. I doubt the aa ability applies to all block, just the inherent block of the shield.

Choombatta

Is your Paladin example using a buckler or T7 shield?
A Paladin with the block AA ( and the normal block adornment ) should have 24%+ block ( the AA adds to the total block ability ).

I am sitting at almost 20% block self buffed, as a buckler using Guardian ( and sitting at 70%+ avoidance raid buffed ).

Also, we have the Paladin OT stand toe to toe with me as MT, not over 20m away ( what good is an OT that stands that far back? ).

And Paladins may have their DPS "gimped" by using a shield, but then again, we are not bringing the Paladin along for his DPS. We are bringing him along for his avoidance.

Anjin

Not being funny here, but the raid progression on Kithicor shows your guild as having not beaten any T1 encounters. I can assure you that there are encounters that involve the OT being more than 20m away from the MT.

Can you categorically confirm that the Pally AA ability adds 24% to ALL block or just the shield? i.e. does it add to +block % on adornments or the benefit on sotgd?

You seem unsure of why you're bringing your paladin along - is it as OT or is it purely to provide avoidance to the MT?

Choombatta

Not all guilds announce their progression to the world, but feel free to look at the gear scattered amongst the roster to get an idea.

Adornments add to the total block chance of the Paladin. The shield, is the only thing giving the Paladin any block in the first place, and acts as the base block chance, with the adornments, and AA ability adding to that base. All of which is uncontested avoidance.

I am not unsure of anything. I have said from the beginning the Paladin is our OT, and having his avoidance buff on me is my preference.

Anjin

Have you tried with a Monk? Have you tried parsing zones with avoidance from Pally vs avoidance from Monk? Is your guild Monk a noob? Isn't it a bit crazy having the OT's avoidance on the MT? What happens if the OT goes down?

What about those encounters where the MT is >20m away from the OT? In the Temple of Korshaa for example there are 4 encounters (3 named & 1 name popper unless you can get around it) that will involve the OT being more than 20m away from the MT (20m isn't far at all btw).