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  1. #11
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    Quote Originally Posted by Maergoth View Post
    {...}
    I look forward to a game where I can use a combat art to point my sword in the sky zelda style, and follow up with two out of five instant cast abilities that make it glow red with little snowflakes around it before the animation completes, having increased crit chance and bonus cold damage or something along those lines.
    {...}
    I feel a little dirty for even making this comparison... but isn't that EQ2 tradeskilling? (Except with an auto-timer)

  2. #12
    "That Guy" Maergoth's Avatar
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    It's a fairly sound comparison, albeit a shallow use of the idea. And since tradeskilling never changes, there's never a need to deviate from a specific pattern or method.

    I personally feel like EQ2's combat AND crafting system. Crafting just fails in application and details.

    The only difference between that and what's in my head, you'd execute an ability (one of several) and it would just immediately pop up a 1-5 button "hotbar", of which you could select 2 or 3 modifiers to use within the window of the cast time. The idea that you could unlock different modifiers for the containing abilities would serve as another avenue for class advancement, besides gaining entirely new abilities that you'd have to find the time and situation to use.
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    Quote Originally Posted by matin View Post
    wow it sickens me to even believe your a person, no human being would say this

    shame on you

  3. #13
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    There is rhythm to EQ2 combat. Just faceroll your keyboard to the beat of whatever music you are listening to!

  4. #14
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    For PvP, combat should be like GW2's Thief (weapon skills are limited by "Initiative", not cooldowns), except make dodging cost Initiative instead of being based on its own pool. You spam the shit out of 1-2 buttons for basic DPS, but you don't just DPS. Active evades, stomps/rezzes, combos, timing, positioning, ect all come into play. Very easy to jump in and have fun but still hard to master.

    For PvE, I actually like the trinity system (but healers/tanks should not be as powerful as they are in EQ2...AoC is a lot more balanced between roles, for example). For GW2's combat to work with a trinity, you'd pretty much have to remove active dodging, which is a big part of what makes the system work in PvP...so not really sure what would be good for PvE.

  5. #15
    "That Guy" Maergoth's Avatar
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    I played a Guardian in GW2 and I enjoyed the combat more than some games, but I felt like I could literally roll my face on the keyboard to succeed. Yes, there was an active playstyle involved, but it didn't really feel like I had that many options. The only reason it was cool is because of weapon switching, and that just felt super gimmicky.

    I'm fine with the DPS/Tank/Heal trinity.

    I disagree with strictly utility classes being thrown in the mix though. Bards, chanters, etc.. those classes could be crunched into other classes without much repercussion. Doing so would also prevent a LOT of stat inflation since you don't need to provide buffs equal to or surpassing the effectiveness of adding raw DPS.

    On the other side of the token though, I love the idea of support classes. Removing bards or chanters from the game would be totally fucking lame. I feel like a pretty solid solution would be to NOT spin the entire game around DPS. Tanks use DPS to hold aggro, priests are expected to use DPS to fill the gaps between heals, and support classes are just DPS with utility. Reducing the reliance on DPS would make enhancing actual DPS classes much more significant.

    There's a happy medium to be found there.

    Population obviously determines the viability of more polarized roles and REQUIRING a group of 3-4 to do anything. Solo content will always be an issue, but I hate solo content anyway.
    Last edited by Maergoth; 04-01-2013 at 05:08 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by matin View Post
    wow it sickens me to even believe your a person, no human being would say this

    shame on you

  6. #16
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    Quote Originally Posted by Maergoth View Post
    I played a Guardian in GW2 and I enjoyed the combat more than some games, but I felt like I could literally roll my face on the keyboard to succeed. Yes, there was an active playstyle involved, but it didn't really feel like I had that many options. The only reason it was cool is because of weapon switching, and that just felt super gimmicky.
    I hated Guardian myself. Thief is unique in GW2 because its weapon skills don't have any cooldowns. Weapon switching was gimmicky on my Mesmer because it was basically just part of my rotation; they might as well have just put all my abilities on one hotbar to save me the trouble. But with Thief, it felt a lot more natural. If I needed a different weapon for the situation (e.g ranged, certain combo fields/finishers), I'd just swap to it without even having to think about if the ability I wanted to use was on cooldown.

    I mean cooldowns are great for EQ2 because even just playing whack-a-mole based on your priority list is a lot more engaging than sitting there spamming 1-3 buttons 90% of the time, but DPSing is only a small part of GW2 (at least in PvP). It's like if you decide you're going to try to balance a hacky sack on your head to make a walk more exciting. That's great. But if you try to play a game of basketball where everyone has to do that, it probably won't be so great. More complicated? I guess, but not more fun.

  7. #17
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    i'd like to begin by saying:
    for a faggot pally, this isn't a half bad thread! you're still not a stonestrong but you're getting there, son!



    this game is too hard for retards and that's why there's 4 million retards who play WoW and tbh this game is fucking easy, so yea if you don't make a game retard easy you're going to be stuck in a niche gamers market and tha'ts what eq2 is imo.

    your ideas are pretty good but it would have to be limited to 3 or 4 "special" abilities for each archetype or something because having each spell have it's own set of out comes become a cluster fuck on my screen and fuck that. haven't really found a game that i like as much as eq2 but i did like the wind up combo thing is aoc and it's too bad the content went to shit because i did like the boobs too! i was sorta hoping for something like the combo thing for this game when i heard about "new combs" but it's not quite the same thing imo.

    for eqnext? i duno.. dont' see myself playing anything else after this game dies but if i do i do wish they don't put so many fucking classes in the game. 25 classes is a bit much and impossible to balance. better off having like.. 10 classes? and give each one multiple roads to doing the same thing. ie. healers have 3 different ways to heal but you dont' have 3 different classes of healers like this game does and the samething for each of the archetypes and shit.


    TLDR:

    good thread faggot pally, i concur.

  8. #18
    "That Guy" Maergoth's Avatar
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    Madvngr has pally problems son.
    99 issues but Stone ain't one.

    Inb4 EQNext is all about building up increments by making silly faces on SOEmote while Mayong tries to sell you player-made furniture on the marketplace.
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    Quote Originally Posted by matin View Post
    wow it sickens me to even believe your a person, no human being would say this

    shame on you

  9. #19
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    Quote Originally Posted by Maergoth View Post

    Inb4 EQNext is all about building up increments by making silly faces on SOEmote while Mayong tries to sell you player-made furniture on the marketplace.
    +1

  10. #20
    Stabbing faces since 2004 Gash.'s Avatar
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    Default Re: How Combat Should Be

    Combat is important. It alone doesnt make a game, but it can sure break one if it sucks (at least for me).

    SWTOR was fucking amazing at first, but (besides a total lack of an end-game) the combat system just drove me away. TWO hotbars of combat abilities, and tons of people were still complaining that there were way too many buttons to press. I could not believe that shit. fucking lulz. It felt like there was very little control. No finesse. Like Maer said, it was a guitar hero guitar instead of the real thing. And the global cooldown made it all feel slooooooow. (1.5sec recovery time on every. single. ability.) And only 8 classes (only 4 group buffs, TOTAL!!) was just disappointing.

    This is how all the new games are though, it seems. Casuals just want everything easy. These people dont want depth/complexity/strategy/challenge. They arent "gamers", imo. They should go watch a movie or some shit. Less buttons to press. I love how eq2 has dozens of classes with like a thousand different buffs. It makes building different group setups fun. It separates the people willing to spend time learning from the people who just mindlessly press buttons. I find it extremely unlikely that EQNext will resemble this at all though. The videogame industry is just constantly being dumbed down because thats where the money is.

    Shit I intended to contribute ideas but I guess I just ranted instead. lol. Oh well, its not like it makes a difference. good thread though
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