Kall

I see Lanet's!

Just give up. You're not even trying now.

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Retired from EQ2.

Playing DotA on US East (Kallp).

Orani

That's right, get on your knees and show your respect. Don't forget to cleanup.

Oh, go cry me a river. Sheesh. It's called non-profit work and we are apparently your favorite charity except seems like some folk require more genuflecting than others.

Vlix_Oasis

It isn't that I don't post it because I don't think you will understand it, I don't because if you have to ask. Whatever I wrote is not doing you any good. If I said my casting order is blah blah and you followed that for every fight you encountered you would only hurt yourself. IMO it is about knowing the arts and knowing how to combine them to do the most DPS. That is something you need to work on yourself especially if your not sure what would be a clear mistake.

Honestly everything else aside. Thank you.

Don't know what your referring too. That was directly more to Sonorous.

I don't know how ideal my conditions were but ok. I never wanted to post a parse, I knew it had nothing to do with this however others wanted it.

Turnstrike is in my mirror spec. Otherwise I run 8 in Poison.

You like that? What is even better is what I used it instead of.

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Staccato: 80 Dirge <autoattack>
Ehtacs: 80 Mystic a.k.a Cure Bitch <autoattack>
Vlix: 80 Assassin retired<autoattack>
Founder and Loot Council Member of Paradise Lost <autoattack>
CHECK OUR WEBSITE FOR CURRENT OPENINGS!

Orani

LOL. Then give the concept of your casting order instead of the actual casting order.

Guy, please. None of this is that difficult; it's just a matter of time. A matter of convenience why we share info on these forums.

There is no reason why ya are unable to share your "knowledge of the arts and how to combine them to do the most". Bro, ya are being self-righteous about this since as ya say, "I don't [post it] because if you have to ask" ... then the assumption is we don't deserve it. Come on now. LOL. /sigh

Wookin

So a newb dirge doing research on how to maximize her class might benefit from a cast order suggestion, a template if you will, of certain combinations of CAs and spells?

And that newb dirge can then take that framework of casting order and play with it until she finds a groove that works well for her gear, stats, buffs, and mobs.

Wouldn't it be nice if knowledgeable dirges shared such a baseline to help those newbies?


And by the way, thanks Kall for all the time you have spent sharing your experience and knowledge. It's appreciated.

Salarionn

WOOKIN #1

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Vlix_Oasis

Although it isn't specific for Dirges, the concepts here are good to understand if you want to know which buttons are best to push at a particular time (i.e. Casting Order).

Maximizing DPS

The equations used are laid out for you so you can get accurate numbers based on your own setup and buffs. So if you do that especially the first equation (average damage/cast time + recovery) for each our our arts. You will know what you should be hitting first.

For our Stealth arts, if you use shroud to get into stealth. I add in the cast time and recovery from shroud as well. I believe this is important because it has to be a 2 step process where 1 does not do any damage.

The later stuff, if you apply it, will help you get a deeper understanding which does make a difference. It isn't necessary for someone who is just starting out.

Another thing I look at is recast times, particularly for something like Daro's. In a nutshell, my reasoning is the more I use Daro's the less chance I have to use something like Lanet's.

So I put Daro's before something much larger like SoD even though the first calculation doesn't support this. It works out because I can cast up to 6 Daro's in the time it takes SoD to revolve once. Thus more damage and why recast on your primary stuff pays off imo.

I do stress delaying SoD for long is not a great idea.

One last thing I consider is where my autoattacks are going to hit when I go through a casting order. I don't want to run into the problem of trying to squeeze in Banshee and Penetrating Shriek between an autoattack. Autoattack damage is our bread and butter so the worst thing you can do is delay it. This is rare but worth keeping in mind if your going to write down this is what I am going to do or maybe alter someone else's.

Well that is my concept on it.

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Staccato: 80 Dirge <autoattack>
Ehtacs: 80 Mystic a.k.a Cure Bitch <autoattack>
Vlix: 80 Assassin retired<autoattack>
Founder and Loot Council Member of Paradise Lost <autoattack>
CHECK OUR WEBSITE FOR CURRENT OPENINGS!

Orani

Hey big boy, I am proud that ya figured a way to share your casting order. Now that was not so hard.

rukkis

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vlix_Oasis Although it isn't specific for Dirges, the concepts here are good to understand if you want to know which buttons are best to push at a particular time (i.e. Casting Order). Maximizing DPS The equations used are laid out for you so you can get accurate numbers based on your own setup and buffs. So if you do that especially the first equation (average damage/cast time + recovery) for each our our arts. You will know what you should be hitting first.

As you explain later on this isn't really the best method for Dirges. There are just to many variables to go with a straight efficiency. While I don't doubt it works well for Wizards and other classes with high damage, long cool down skills, it doesn't translate to us well at all.

Quote:

For our Stealth arts, if you use shroud to get into stealth. I add in the cast time and recovery from shroud as well. I believe this is important because it has to be a 2 step process where 1 does not do any damage.

Not to nitpick, but Shroud has no recovery, Bump has a normal 1/2 second recovery though.

Quote:

One last thing I consider is where my autoattacks are going to hit when I go through a casting order. I don't want to run into the problem of trying to squeeze in Banshee and Penetrating Shriek between an autoattack. Autoattack damage is our bread and butter so the worst thing you can do is delay it. This is rare but worth keeping in mind if your going to write down this is what I am going to do or maybe alter someone else's. Well that is my concept on it.

Auto attack shouldn't be a big concern at all when laying out a casting order imo. I'm not saying that you shouldn't pay attention to your timer or whatever you use, but unless you're deliberately trying to screw it up, it shouldn't be a big deal. The majority of our skills have such a fast cast time that they would barely delay anything.

Even if two of our longer casting skills are back to back initially it wont make much of a difference except for short meaningless fights. The first time you rip though your order you might delay an AA or two by 1/2 a second each. After that it really doesn't matter. Once everything is down all you have to do is whack a mole with half a brain, not hitting anything long right before an AA. The only few skills that would be an issue have varying reuse timers so they wont be back to back the second time around.

From what Ive seen, delaying AAs is only going to hurt your DPS if you repeatedly make mistakes. The occasional .5 seconds at the start of the fight won't make or break you.

My thoughts for what its worth. No superstar but I am usually happy with my results, all things considered. Except for that month or so where Kall took my manhood.

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Orani

Yeah, I generally agree if cast speed is buffed up well enough.

For younger Dirges, without decent cast speed and 2.4s weapon delays, it's easier to delay autoattacks ~.8s and higher. Otherwise,~.4s autoattack delays is insigifnicant on short encounter durations. Aside, autoattacks activate during recovery time; this is why an autoattack does not trigger after Shroud if ya have Shroud+M.kiss macroed since Shroud does not have a recovery.

Weapon delay and encounter duration seem to determine the affects of delayed autoattacks since it's easier to delay a 2.4s swing and easier to get more delays in a 5 minute encounter duration.

However, I bet regardless encounter duration, if ya ~.4s delay autoattacks each autoattack, then the affect is huge apparently, but seems to me tough to delay each autoattack by ~.4s almost to the point it would have to be intentional.