Naar

Class consolidation is that classic mistaken belief that less is more, it's not. AA's are not a replacement for individual classes, we are starting to reach the stage where the 'class label' that a person wears is no longer any guarentee about what role they could play in a group situation, we already have priests who cannot heal (and some who refuse to even hot-bar their heals)

A complete overhaul of gear itemization is a must, with a clearly defined upgrade path that involves tradeskill as well as loot drops. 'Treasured' should be split into two catagories, at present some treasures are valuable upgrades and some are frankly nothing more than vender trash (common mob drops for the purpose of selling to vendors, but which still have some stats).

A complete overhaul of spell/skill strengths is also required to ensure that an upgrade is always an upgrade and realign all abilities to either a every 10 level or every 14 level system, it's one or the other, the currently mix is a mess with some skills going 'grey' before the upgrade is available while others are replaced too soon.

A complete overhaul of guild rewards, removing personal rewards such as housing and mounts (which currently you get to keep after leaving the 'uber' guild you joined yesterday) and instead providing the guild with facilities which aid it's members but which expire when you leave that guild.

But on the actual question of the OP: Yes, I would accept a NGE type change as long as the class structure remain intact or consolidation was minimal (or we had consolidate of old classes with some new classes thrown in). I would not be very happy if I found my Warlock and Wizard were now the 'same class'. Re-roll options for those who end up with two of the same classes would be required (and no, I don't mean start at level 1 again).

Any sort of NGE would need to be mindful that the majority of the playerbase are 'casual gamers', these people have invested some of there minimal free time into their characters, anything that seems to nullify their efforts (ending up with two characters the same class/tradeskill after consolidation, or with their attuned gear nerfed to uselessness) will turn them away from the game.

Subscriptions = Profits = Longevity

Less Subscriptions = Less Profits = Dead Game with no investment

aduros

Less Subscriptions = Less Profits = Less Development Resources = Incomplete Expansion = RoK = Less Subscriptions

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Sheya

Those against class consolidation: do you know how retardedly better is a templar compared to an inquiz?
Or a swashy compared to a brigand?
Or an illy compared to a coercer?

The "bastard child" classes usually get a bone tossed to them, see Dispatch, Enraging Demeanor, Zealotry, etc.
Remove those skills and you have a big pile of fucking nothing.

I just can't understand why this merge didn't happen yet. Be happy with your skill01_bot title here and keep fighting the good fights.

Caswydian

Another thing I wanted to comment on - people seem to toss around the term NGE for just about any sort of change. The NGE change to SWG was much more than just a revision of certain game rules and mechanics, it was a complete change in the nature of the game. The original SWG was very open-ended, with a class-less system and very involved crafting and economic system, on par with EVE Online. The NGE completely changed the entire game, to the point where you really have two different SWG games. A class or spell consolidation in EQ2 is nothing compared to the degree of change brought about by the NGE.

Caswydian

No, not really. My guildmates who play those respective classes realize they have strengths and weaknesses, but that their classes are not 'retardedly' worse than their 'good' counterparts, just different. From a raiding perspective, all those classes bring certain needed abilities to a raid, and in a grouping situation, all are capable of fulfilling their primary roles.

Caswydian

Do you seriously believe this? The scale of RoK is beyond anything SOE has thus far attempted, and while some things remain to be added or could be improved upon, to claim this is an incomplete expansion due to lack of resources is laughably ignorant.

aduros

Yes.

Now include the fucked itemization, horrible raid progression, bugged quest/spells, and you have the very definition of an incomplete expansion. They had almost a year to work on this expansion, and for so many issues to fall through the cracks, it show that their resources were limited. They blamed the lack of epics on the San Diego fires for christ's sake. To believe this expansion is a finished product and working as intended, is laughably ignorant.

*Please send a pm with the language you would like that translated to if your having trouble understanding.

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Deludar

These are the classes we should have

Priest

Shaman: Just one class, both are pretty much the same and can be comibined easily

Cleric: See above. You can have different AA lines allowing a MT cleric to go more defenisive, and an OT cleric to get better DPS buffs, etc.

Druid: Same as cleric. Defensive and offensive lines. MAKE the AAs in such a way that defensive druids need to go one way where mage druids or DPS druids need to go another

Fighters

Warrior: One class. Defensive and offensive AA line AS WELL AS buffs. We only get 5 concentration slots, make people need to think about what buffs they are gonne run for class distinction. This should go for all classes

Pally/SK: Keep these seperate

Brawler: Why the fuck are there two of these?

Scouts

Bard: Merge them. Allow "Mage/Melee" bard specs based on what buffs they are running and some sort of AA distinction. If you go down AA_Line 1 it locks AA_Line 2.

Ranger/Assasin: Keep Seperate

Swashy/Brig: Merge these. Make dispatch and end line ability as well as other end line abilies that are worth. Have raid guils be saying "I need one Dispatch speced Rogue and one Spell_X specced Rogue." Dont allow anyone to be specced for both

Mage

Enchanters: Merge these fucks

Necro/Conj: Keep Seperate

Wizard/Warlock: MERGE!!! Give two seperate main AA line paths. By going down one path you LOCK the other, so you can't do both. One path can focus on increased the power of you spells. One path can focus on adding encounter and AE bases to those nukes.


This would essentially give 15 classes. Who says each archtype needs to be the same number? Make people need to be somewhat intelligent. Give bards 15 buffs, but only the ability to have 7 running at a time. It would allow for more diversity in a raid force as well. You're "dirge" can't come today and you really need a hate transfer? Drop your bard from the mage group, have him change some spells, and there you go.

The best part about having it this way, is this...Lets say you MT Cleric quits the game, Insteas of looking for just a templar, you just need to find a cleric. And you can have you "offensive inquisitor" cleric just respec his AAs so you can keep going in the meantime.

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Caswydian

Complaints about itemization and raid progression are matters of opinion. That you do not like them does not mean the expansion is incomplete.

There are bugs in a few quests and with a few abilities, but this pretty much universally true to MMOs regardless of resources. (In fact, buggy software is endemic to the software industry as a whole, from a company the size of Microsoft on down to your small one or two person operations.)

The lack of epics is quite possibly due to the fires, or it could be they just didn't finish everything in time - perhaps they discovered some last minute bugs, or realized that they needed to revisit the itemization on the rewards.

Again, none of this is indicative of a lack of resources, however. In fact, some could be attributed to having to many resources committed to a project, thus causing more bugs and delays.

Caswydian

Would items be designed around certain AA lines? Obviously, a more melee/offensive oriented priest will want different items than a pure healer, correct?

What measures would b in place to prevent their from being clearly optimal builds fr each class, effectively killing any diversity by making certain specs required for effective gameplay?