Death to RMT - Page 17

Talonis · 05-25-2007, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hammarus

But I question why you would need anything beyond them. Your arguement has been that the progression of spells needs to match that of armor, weapons, and other items. Yet if that was going to be the case, where are my fabled potions, my fabled II weapons and armor, my fabled III weapons and armor, etc. If your going, and Illuminator has said the same, to use other items in the game to derive an order to the value of spells, it better be across the board and not just for the spells. And there better be a clear distinction between all things in the game that are of like quality. Which gets to the heart of the number one issue, Itemization.

Gear progression doesn't need additional tiers, stupid. The framework exists already. The completely separate issue of Itemization needs to fill those tiers with gear that makes sense. Unfortunately, the concept flies right over the heads of retards like you that fail to see the structure, and just want an item with the label that says "Fabled II". Way to show just how fucking ignorant you are to the issue.

I guess I can accept there may be a need to introduce a new tier of spell at either the top or between player crafted and current M1 to fix the framework of spell progression, although I still feel the same could be accomplished through adjustment of drop rates and where they drop with the current framework. Both accomplish the same, but the latter example I proposed is viewed as a nerf, whereas the former would likely be viewed as an addition or enhancement.

Either way, the top tier spells (or spell components) should never drop from anything less than top tier encounters. I also still think any encounter intended for more than a single group should never drop anything that can be traded (read: sold on the open market).

Widem · 05-25-2007, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MysidiaDrakkenbane

Nope, I'd be one of the assholes that offers it to my guildies or guild banks it. I find it absurd to spend 25p on a spell, hence why I refuse to buy them at that price. Which is why I suggested making them No Drop so that they wouldn't be 25p and the plat sellers can go fucking screw off and find another way to make their money.

I would like to point out this is one of the stupidest posts i have ever seen...now comes the reason.

1. Botters farming/selling masters drives the price down.
2. Making them no trade would drive the price way up.

You complain about the cost then impliment something that would make them more expensive. Congratulations.

Talonis · 05-25-2007, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rinion

Yes because their is no RNG and the named are guarnteed to drop only masters for your class.
I farmed all the time on bazaar mainly hitting the three heroic named in Temple of scale and various other contested Heroics, daily.

During the entire KoS xpac up till I quit I never saw a ranger master drop while farming, ever.

The few that droped on raids were shit ones like Hawk dive, ones I already had because they were common and bought for minimal plat.

Hey then what bit of money you make form al lthat farming you can spend all at once on the single master you had been looking for! awesome right!?

Which is exactly why my idea (and yours as described in the PM) of making no-trade crafting components drop instead of 'completed' spells. Folks would get their spell books and CA's filled out faster. It just makes sense.

Talonis · 05-25-2007, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Widem

I would like to point out this is one of the stupidest posts i have ever seen...now comes the reason.

1. Botters farming/selling masters drives the price down.
2. Making them no trade would drive the price way up.

You complain about the cost then impliment something that would make them more expensive. Congratulations.

Are you really convinced raid forces en masse are going to get into the business of farming zones specifically for the purpose of making money to sell looting rights? I think the actual number of guilds that have the patience to do this on a regular basis is much smaller than you think. Do you foresee an army of casuals buying plat and standing around waiting for raiding guild 'X' to announce in 60-69 that there is master spell component 'X' for sale? I think this number is smaller than you think also. Sure, there are guilds that do this now and have regular 'customers', but it is still a smaller number than implied, and is dwarfed in comparison to those that buy plat to get spells off the broker now.

The point is, it would be a considerable amount of time before a raiding guild outfitted it's own mains and alts before a surplus of components would be available for sale/auction to buyers.

Alania · 05-25-2007, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talonis

Which is exactly why my idea (and yours as described in the PM) of making no-trade crafting components drop instead of 'completed' spells. Folks would get their spell books and CA's filled out faster. It just makes sense.

This worked out fairly well in EQ1 for POP, but they kinda screwed the pooch by requiring lvl 65 spells to have the rare, no-trade item. With consignment, there really wouldn't be a NEED for guilds to advertise for someone to buy loot rights. Merely DKP out the spares once the whole guild is mastered out, and the crafters that can make the spells can pick them up and sell them for gobs of cash. Not too fair to those who can't craft spells, but the leadership could always say that they can get the spares if they put the profit into the guild bank for the monthly split.

Talonis · 05-25-2007, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alania

This worked out fairly well in EQ1 for POP, but they kinda screwed the pooch by requiring lvl 65 spells to have the rare, no-trade item. With consignment, there really wouldn't be a NEED for guilds to advertise for someone to buy loot rights. Merely DKP out the spares once the whole guild is mastered out, and the crafters that can make the spells can pick them up and sell them for gobs of cash. Not too fair to those who can't craft spells, but the leadership could always say that they can get the spares if they put the profit into the guild bank for the monthly split.

That is whole reason for making the components no-trade and require consignment to make the actual spell. They can't be sold unless the rights are sold to loot the component. I think that would be prohibitive enough to discourage it on a large scale.

Alania · 05-25-2007, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talonis

That is whole reason for making the components no-trade and require consignment to make the actual spell. They can't be sold unless the rights are sold to loot the component. I think that would be prohibitive enough to discourage it on a large scale.

Consignment dear friend. I show up with some incense and 25p, and walk away with my brand-spankin-new master with the no-drop component the crafter won on the raid.

Talonis · 05-25-2007, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alania

Consignment dear friend. I show up with some incense and 25p, and walk away with my brand-spankin-new master with the no-drop component the crafter won on the raid.

The consignment system doesn't work like that, friend. It would require you to have the no-trade component, not the crafter.

Pinski · 05-25-2007, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talonis

Are you really convinced raid forces en masse are going to get into the business of farming zones specifically for the purpose of making money to sell looting rights?

You mean, we aren't already?

Widem · 05-25-2007, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talonis

Are you really convinced raid forces en masse are going to get into the business of farming zones specifically for the purpose of making money to sell looting rights? I think the actual number of guilds that have the patience to do this on a regular basis is much smaller than you think. Do you foresee an army of casuals buying plat and standing around waiting for raiding guild 'X' to announce in 60-69 that there is master spell component 'X' for sale? I think this number is smaller than you think also. Sure, there are guilds that do this now and have regular 'customers', but it is still a smaller number than implied, and is dwarfed in comparison to those that buy plat to get spells off the broker now.

The point is, it would be a considerable amount of time before a raiding guild outfitted it's own mains and alts before a surplus of components would be available for sale/auction to buyers.

I dont understand what you are arguing. What you are saying here is that then a master spell iwould be "priceless". which the post i was replying to was complaining about the cost of masters and that farming them was to blame, which is wrong. This is even more basic of an econ principle supply vs. demand...u just took away the supply except for of course to me the raider.

Your whole argument here is against the basis of capitalism itself and in my opinion is pretty dumb. If you make plat worthless, which is what it looks like, currency will just take on another form whether it be items or anything else.

EDIT-BTW if the only way you could get a master is this way, then yes, players would wait in masses for a guild sell a master b/c they would have no other choice.