Kotrak

I just wanted to get some opinions on betraying from a zerk to a guard for mostly OT duties with the occasional MT'ing.
I'm wondering if the snap aggro and defensive gains are worth the dps and ae hate loss.
For MT'ing i definately see the guardian advantage, but with OT'ing I'm at a bit of a loss for which would end up being better in the long run.

the_mo

the "long run" kinda depends on what tier of mobs youre going to tank... well no actually it doesnt sorry.

"long run" depends on, whether soe will fix the zerk class and put more AE-encounters into the next xpac/advpack, but until that happens its more a matter of group effectivity:

if your OT-group is really solid, youd been better off with a zerk, since he buffs the groups dps (which is like his only advantage at the moment).. talking about zerk inq dirge myst swash/assn illy- kind of groups here

Davram

Our zerker has done just fine tanking Nexona/Druushk adds even through the memwipes and disarm. There are a few OT fights in VP that could use snap agro, but you'll find yourself much more effective as a zerker on Avatar adds.

Tasi

That's not strictly true.
I recently betrayed from zerker for the reason of survivability issues as the major factor. As sad as it made me.
Yeh great so zerkers can tank druushk/Nexona adds with consumate ease and without threat of dying, but hold on a sec, they are x2 mob's.
With respect to avatar add's and the effectiveness of certain mythical weapons now a guard can put out just as much AE DPS as a berserker, and if you have the right aggro transfer's in group, hate should not be an issue with an AE encounter. If it is quit the game or change class.

Zerker's offer the one buff to the group, which in fairness is DPS but meh, every group in the raid is/should be built around this anyway to maximise efficiency. (and that can be provided by many other means of class).

The real problem that a zerker has where a guard doesn't fail is the ability to gain hate instantly without the use of hate gain modifiers.
Insolence is a cool ability and all but is only working to true potential once you have aggro, and lets face it, you'd be foolish to be o'ting with all the hate transfer's / modifiers on you anyway. Your only gonna piss the MT off.

So to answer the op's question: Betray

1. Survivabilty isn't as big an issue.
2. The difference in DPS between zerk/guard AE and single target is next to none.
3. The ability to gain aggro instantly should you have to.

Atleast until SoE do either of the following:

1. Give the Zerker some kinda distinguishing feature that sets them apart from a guard again.
2. Put more AE encounters into the next xpac.


Tasi

Lizerd Keng

With zerker having 3 damage type CA's that are AE and/or AOE + offensive stance AE + mythical weapon having 100% chance for auto attack AOE + proc on mythical for an AE + destruction AE, I don't see the dps difference being "next to none".

If a guard is doing the same amount of dps on multiple mobs, and they are in the same group, then the zerker isn't doing something right. If it's a single mob, possibly even 2 mobs, and the guard is MT buffed while the zerker is playing buff bot to a scout group then I'd agree with "next to none". I typically jump 400dps just from pulling aggro and getting my damage shield-type procs working (agresive defense, weapon aegis, buckler reversal, maybe another group buff) . The OT group mentioned above "zerk inq dirge myst swash/assn illy" doesn't do alot for a zerker except put them further into diminishing returns on haste, probably well over cap. Dirge and assn is good though. With gu44, ranger is the class zerkers will probably want.

For a tank (MT or OT), it's about holding aggro on all of them, not just about damage, and guard's do have good aggro tools. If it's just about holding aggro, you can make either class work good. imo, there is no right answer. Pick the one you like to play the most, or if you're willing, play the one your guild wants you to.

Chumann

Either warrior class makes a viable MT and/or OT. It's just that it's far easier to do both as a guardian imo. That's the biggest difference.

Ower

As MT yes. as OT no. Imo that is.

Ower

Then i want the see some parses from that. singel targets the dps should be close tho. But on groups a zerk rapes a guard. pls post some parses....

Mwink

Careful guys when Jaraxx sees this hes going to going to have a fielday

Shandreya

Uh, no.

To OP: Both work, and of course everyone knows guard is a better class than zerk atm so, if you don't care and/or aren't attached to your class/playstyle, as offtank, you can go either way, there's nothing I've seen this expansion as an offtank that you really need a lot of survivability for, though.

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