Guardian stats help - Page 3

Wulfghar · 05-11-2009, 06:44 PM

Going by your original post:

3 seconds is the primary delay for a guardian weapon. Your fabled epic is 3 seconds, as well as the mythical version. Reason why I believe 3 seconds is preferable to 4 seconds is two-fold: a.) with haste added into the mix, I have time to throw one combat art between each auto attack, thus extending my power and allowing my auto attack to constitute 50-60% of my dps per fight. b.) because I don't feel like listening to scouts whine about the tank taking their offhand weapons.

During RoK, Block was considered to be the reigning stat, due to its uncontested nature. By uncontested, I mean that the stat was not effected by c/p/s buffs on the mob, debuffs to your defense or parry that happen to be active at the time, etc etc. Basically anything that makes it easier for him to hit or harder for you to defend was not added into the avoidance check against block. However, (and someone else can explain this nerf) SoE decided to nerf block in such a way that as it stands currently, shield effectiveness is the reigning stat that tanks look for. Shield effectiveness increases your protection level on your shield, thus increasing your avoidance. Parry and defense are easily capped and shouldn't be worried about, per say. Prior to TSO, I would normally take a piece that had crit or da over a piece that had 3-4 parry or defense. At the moment, however, there are very nice pieces available that balance both offensive and defensive abilities.

Aggression is a joke. I honestly couldn't tell you what my current aggression is without logging on and looking at my toon. More dps = less need for taunts. Melee crit is superior to double attack for increasing threat (explained in my first post). Combat art damage for tanks is sort of like spell damage for mages. Most mages go for spell crit first, and once that is capped, they begin looking for pieces with spell damage to continue adding to their parse. Reason for this is, crit > da > ca dmg > aggression. If your melee crit isn't at least 75%, don't worry about combat art damage yet.

As for resists, for heroic zones RoK was alot of poison and disease with some heat thrown in for good measure. TSO seems to be more magic and mental, with a dab of cold thrown in. If you are talking about raiding, then prepare to carry a shitload of gear around with you at all times. At any given time, you may need to raise one, two, or three resists over 10k. If you can get your hands on an Ill Will ( \aITEM 1390867252 -1031868024:[Ill Will]\/a ) it will greatly decrease the need for all that extra tonnage in your bags.

Abilities that should be run when low on power -
Defensive: Sentinel Sphere, Fortify, Tower of Stone, Block, Defensive Minded.
Offensive/Hate gain: Seperate, Trespass, Sentinel Strike, Reinforcement.

*Edited to include answers to your recent questions*
A piece that reads "vs magic" means versus damage that is classified as "Magic" and has that unique resist. A piece that reads "vs all magical damage" means versus any non-physical damage (heat, cold, divine, poison, disease, magic, mental)

Mitigation is only good against physical attacks or abilities/ae's that hit for crushing, piercing, or slashing. Avoidance only works against physical attacks. Not spell damage.

Agility increases your base avoidance. Defense (I believe) increases your base avoidance. Parry increases your parry check (seperate from base avoidance). Block increases your block check (also seperate). Deflection is a brawler skill.

Anap KaSplat · 05-11-2009, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atavax

if you cant tell the difference between your first post and salle's then please dont respond.

you need to step down a tad. I'm supposed to be the resident asshole on the Guard forums. Stop trying to ninja me!

Atavax · 05-12-2009, 02:12 AM

so whats the difference between base avoidance, block, parry, and deflection? are they all the same thing except different names?

salle · 05-12-2009, 05:40 AM

They're pretty much the same, except with parry you have a 10% chance if you do parry to do a riposte... deflection is a skill brawlers have, which we don't, so it's pointless, things with dodge% does still work though.

Halbarad · 05-12-2009, 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atavax

ummm, is vs magic good against all non-physical damage or do i need to keep specifically vs heat and vs mental and vs other sets? and does mitigation only mitigate against physical damage? does any/all avoidance stats work on non-physical damage?

also what avoidance stats doe agi increase? same thing as defense? or parry, block, deflection?

Spell Damage is often referred to as magic damage, hence the confusion with magic damage as part of the arcane type spell damage.

Three Categories for spell damage: Arcane, Elemental, Noxious (like the cure pots for example)
Arcane: Magic, Divine, Mental
Noxious: Disease, Poison
Elemental: Heat, Cold

Vs. Magic is good versus damage that appears as magic damage in your log
Vs. Cold mitigates damage that appears as cold damage
Continue the list for heat, divine, mental, disease, poison.

Mitigation (your Armor) mitigates everything that appears as slashing, crushing and piercing damage.

Jewelry with +vs. crushing etc adds mitigation vs. that damage type.

Completely un-mitigatable is Focus damage.

Avoidance doesn't work on Spell Attacks - but you can resist them completely. I don't know exactly what factors in there but it is a mix of your level vs. mob level, mob's to hit bonus and your resists vs. that damage type.

AGI, as far as I know, works like defense, it adds a bit more chance that mobs miss. You can test it by switching out gear (that has no other avoidance skills) and compare the avoidance tooltip values with higher and with lower agi.

Halbarad · 05-12-2009, 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atavax

so whats the difference between base avoidance, block, parry, and deflection? are they all the same thing except different names?

Base Avoidance: Mob misses you
Block: Mob tries to hit you, but you block
Parry: Mob tries to hit you, but you parry
Deflection: Brawler version of Block since they don't have shields.

They are different checks and that is why you can't add their values.

Taking random values:

Total Avoidance: 62%

Base Avoidance: 33%
Block: 27%
Parry: 21%

The Mob attacks you 100 times
First check: Miss: 33% - 33/100 Misses: 67 Hits are left
Second check: Block: 27% - 18/67 Blocks: 49 Hits are left
Third Check: Parry: 21% - 10/49 Parries: 39 Hits are left.

You have to add the additional checks here as well: Parry Wrist Adornments, Riposte Sword Adornment and other items.

Whether Block/Miss/Parry is checked first, second or last and where the additional checks are in that order I can't tell you.

Edit: spelling sucks

salle · 05-12-2009, 06:18 PM

I think the parry%, riposte%, block% etc extra chances are added into the base value in the ingame calculations.

Halbarad · 05-13-2009, 05:44 AM

Possible, yeah.

Steelbadger · 05-13-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salle

I think the parry%, riposte%, block% etc extra chances are added into the base value in the ingame calculations.

All uncontested bonuses are added as separate checks. The checks are applied in the persona window to their related avoidance type (except Riposte which is linked to Base, not Parry).

So say you have 50% Base, 30% Block and 25% Parry (Total of 73.8% avoidance)

Then you get a +3% parry adorn for a wrist slot and your persona window should go up to about 50% Base, 30% Block and 27.3% Parry (74.5% Avoid).

Then you get a +3% riposte on your weapon and your persona window shows 51.5% Base, 30% Block and 27.3% Parry (75.3% Avoid)

The way the maths is worked out is 50% avoided, 30% of the remainder blocked then 25% of those still remaining are parried. You then parry a further 3% thanks to the adornment, then you riposte a further 3% of the remaining hits on top of that.

How it's worked out:

Of 1000 hits:

250 are parried thanks to your parry skill
22.5 are parried thanks to your parry adornment
218.25 are blocked thanks to your shield protection and shield effectiveness
254.625 then miss thanks to your base avoidance due to agility and defence
7.63875 are then riposted thanks to your riposte adornment

So of 1000 hits you avoided 753 of them (75.3% avoid) and you riposted 37 times (20% of your parries become ripostes and all of your ripostes become ripostes)

You can then work it backwards to find out the persona window values for your parry, for example. You parried a total of 272.5 hits of the 1000, therefore your parry chance is displayed as 27.25%
You Blocked 218.25 hits of 727.5 swings and so you have 30% Block (as expected as this example has no block adornment)
Your Base avoidance caused 362.26375 swings to miss out of 509.25 swings and so you have 51.5% Base.

It's all a bit convoluted but it's important to remember that every uncontested parry, riposte, block or avoid chance effect is a separate check.

Parry% adds to Parry, Block% adds to Block, Riposte% and Dodge% both add to Base.

To simplify it:

The benefit you will see from an X% buff is = (1-Partial Avoidance Before X% is applied) x X%

So in the example above:
Benefit = (1-0.25) x 3%
Benefit = 0.75 x 3%
Benefit = 2.25%

For Parry.

Chumann · 05-17-2009, 10:34 PM

The main problem is that your question is too general. You have to realize that a comprehensive list of the way to optimize your guardian is both a) 100% relative to your own gear and the people you play with and b) encompasses 4 years of experience that can't be formed in one simple post.

If you don't want "bullshit" answers, don't ask bullshit generic questions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atavax

you have shield block chance% as being least dimishing, but then you have block as dimishing. what ingame stats that i'll see in gear increase the least diminshing; the shied block chance%?
Yes, but they are very rare. The changed a lot of the % increase bonuses to protection % increases which, in and of themselves, are less significant but still useful.

does combart art damage increase any of the effects of a combat art other then the damage? such as the debuffs or threat bonuses of some of them?
No, it only affects the damage of the CA. It takes whatever number it would have hit for and adds the total CA damage increase, not to exceed a 50% increase.

do any forms of avoidance disrupt your auto-attack, if so, which ones do and dont?
No. Unless I'm not understanding the question which is a little strange. Your ability to avoid an attack has absolutely nothing to do with your ability to attack in any way.

does defense increase other forms of avoidance?
No, it only increases your base chance to avoid (dodge). It does not increase parry or block.

do any type of attack not disupt auto-attacks? if so which ones?
It's not just attacks, it's anything you cast (unless it's an instant cast). As long as you're casting when you should have auto attacked, your auto attack will be delayed until your cast is completed.

** So I just realized that I only read the first page of this thread. I'm not deleting it since I think this Atavax guy is a bit of a tool and is just looking for a quick fix to his problems.