EQ2 Flames Consolidated Developer Information List - Page 110

Gaidal · 03-14-2008, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flybait

I cant see how people can read all this, see the proof about preferential treatment, loot handouts, giving out strats, test to live transfers, and eq2players forum nazi-ism and still not get the fact that the csr/gm/dev situation is fubar.
Devs shouldn't be allowed to play, much like people who work at casinos cant gamble there.
GMs should be held to higher standards than normal players, not lower ones.

That being said, they are human, they are going to take advantage of the situation if they can, and on that side of the situation, it's an issue of SOE not policing their own.

/agree with this post

and no matter how you look at it, the entire situation is just bullshit.

Prof · 03-14-2008, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcjester

P.S. To the dude who hopes I never am in a jury, sorry to break it to ya dude, but I've been a member of 2 juries in my life, 1 civil and 1 criminal court 1 federal and 1 district trial. So I do have a fundimental understanding of admissable evidence, procedings, verdicts etc.

By that logic, the jury on the OJ trial had a fundamental understanding of court proceedings too... yet they failed to even ring the bell twice. Sitting on two trials does not a Law Degree make.

Quote:

Originally Posted by checkov

Open minded thinkers would not demand iron clad evidence. They would be open to the possibilities by definition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcjester

That holds true in civil court where defendants don't have to be 100% guilty to have a verdict go against them, however criminal court is a different thing entirely.

You brought up the open minded statement outside the context of court. It holds true everywhere though. To be open minded you are open to other ideas weighing the facts of both sides and putting your personal bias aside to come up with an answer. If everyone on a criminal trial jury was closed minded, you'd end up with a hung jury.

vcjester · 03-14-2008, 10:50 PM

As for Devs not being allowed to play, I don't agree with that. How else would they know what to fix or have any idea of game mechanics? I do however believe that all devs should be required to play on test only.

I don't agree with a lot of the shit that happens with the "beta" players either. I remember how loams and treasured gear became extremely rare just prior to EoF launch and popped back up on the broker the day of launch at outrageous prices....

Coincidence or someone abusing a beta invite to give them an unfair advantage over "average joe" eq2 player? It could never be proven....

checkov · 03-14-2008, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcjester

That holds true in civil court where defendants don't have to be 100% guilty to have a verdict go against them, however criminal court is a different thing entirely.

That statement is completely false. I mean completely false. That alone disqualifies you from further debate. Civil court requires much less to convict, however, criminal courts still convict on circumstantial evidence. Perhaps some court tv time might be a good thing for you to watch or forensic files or body of evidence etc. for educational purposes.

Flybait · 03-14-2008, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcjester

As for Devs not being allowed to play, I don't agree with that. How else would they know what to fix or have any idea of game mechanics? I do however believe that all devs should be required to play on test only.

/bugreport
/petition
/betacopy

/thread

vcjester · 03-14-2008, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prof

By that logic, the jury on the OJ trial had a fundamental understanding of court proceedings too... yet they failed to even ring the bell twice. Sitting on two trials does not a Law Degree make.

You brought up the open minded statement outside the context of court. It holds true everywhere though. To be open minded you are open to other ideas weighing the facts of both sides and putting your personal bias aside to come up with an answer. If everyone on a criminal trial jury was closed minded, you'd end up with a hung jury.

Couldn't say it better myself, we're getting off track and I understand that people need to be open to both sides. I just wanted to defend the poor schmucks that say, "hey, maybe they aren't totally guilty of everything people are claiming here" and instantly get ripped apart being called morons, idiots, fanbois etc.

vcjester · 03-14-2008, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by checkov

That statement is completely false. I mean completely false. That alone disqualifies you from further debate. Civil court requires much less to convict, however, criminal courts still convict on circumstantial evidence. Perhaps some court tv time might be a good thing for you to watch or forensic files or body of evidence etc. for educational purposes.

Ummm what is so false about it? You just said what I did in a different way. Civil court I said that "they DON'T have to be 100% guilty"

As for the criminal court, all I know is that (and correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just going by one personal experience) the jury needs 100% guilty vote in order to pass a guilty verdict. How they come to those votes is interly up to each and every member.

As for evidence, thats between the judge and the lawyers to decide what is admissable and what isn't. If it is accepted, it's the juries responsiblity to take it as factual evidence unless proven otherwise and then it's there job to forget that it ever existed.

dawy · 03-14-2008, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcjester

As for Devs not being allowed to play, I don't agree with that. How else would they know what to fix or have any idea of game mechanics? I do however believe that all devs should be required to play on test only.

I don't agree with a lot of the shit that happens with the "beta" players either. I remember how loams and treasured gear became extremely rare just prior to EoF launch and popped back up on the broker the day of launch at outrageous prices....

Coincidence or someone abusing a beta invite to give them an unfair advantage over "average joe" eq2 player? It could never be proven....

I thought most of the devs played WOW..or was that just Smed?

Laodaron · 03-14-2008, 11:06 PM

But that option isn't available. That's why those people are idiots.

vcjester · 03-14-2008, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laodaron

But that option isn't available. That's why those people are idiots.

Spoken like a true flamer! LMAO

I give that a 2 thumbs up.