Inquisitor DPS mode now pointless (endgame)??

Fritzzz · 03-30-2008, 05:32 PM

This is very endgame. Not heroic, not solo.

In Eof I could be 2nd - 5th on the dps parses, but now so many people can get higher dps (4.5-8k dps) with such sleep mode ease, is it better at this point to just give up totally on trying to dps and instead just over heal?

Through my tests our increase to haste/spell recovery does such minimal addition to dps it also seems kind of pointless. -- (lol -- it's seems better now to be in a caster group since most melee have such high haste anyway)

For example-
A) I could dps and contribute an extra 2.4-3.4 k dps
or

I could over heal and proc heal effects on the group. while still doing around 1k dps. -- this mode also means it's impossible to run out of mana, and you are also giving your group tons of extra mana. That extra mana adds up to more dps for everyone.

I'm interested in arguments FOR dps mostly, so i any Inq out there are hardcore into DPS mode in ROK put your case down so I can go over it.

The vast raise in DPS for other classes compared to the increase of INQ dps has set a trend of us loseing our position in the DPS chain IMO. If the trend continues next expac we will be doing around 4k dps, while casters/scouts will be doing 9-12k.

At what point are we obsoleted?

Stoic · 03-30-2008, 05:57 PM

I am a big fan of Legos, and because of that I think alot of pieces coming together even tiny pieces make for a great work of art or fun. Now maybe we only do 2.5k to 4k dps depending on the situation and gear. My guild doing 102k dps wouldn't be possible without my little contribution. A few times we have come a couple k away from hitting 120k dps. If everyone is working together including the priests we can get those numbers.

I think you might be more concerned with our own personal dps and not the raid as a whole. I have always been interested in my own dps but that doesn't make the "raid" good. Putting forth our contribution on the fights that we can be part of in a melee sense doesn't mean it isn't any less of a contribution. Yeah our assassin does 9-10k by himself which is downright sick, but it doesn't make my 3k not help with the overall dps. I guess we just can't be selfish anymore about being able to get on the parse. They would have to create a weapon that would allow us to be better than others and not an ability.

Back in KOS Vrak club and 100% crit were fricken amazing cause %crit gear was so rare. Now if a melee class has less than 50% in a raid they are slacking. Not to mention Double Attack gear and the sheer fact scouts and fighters have a base % more damage with the same weapon than we get. A brawler using a vrak club in the day could outdo our dps easily without 100% melee crit. The thing is Gear now a days has overshadowed most of our buffs from giving us that edge that we used to have. Yea we can self buff pretty well and junk but the idea that we are gonna actually compete on the DPS parse where the lowest person is sitting at 5.5k is ludicrous. Next expansion everyone will have 75% self buffed melee crit and shortly after that they will create a melee crit diminishing returns because they don't know how to compensate for it, thus making our STA line a joke cause you will then need 300% melee crit to actually have 100 melee crit. Its all a big cluster fuck to be honest. But to get back to the point at hand.

No we will never be able to compete with competant players on high end raid content nor will our DPS be that impressive anymore either. I however still think it helps the raid as a whole. Scourging makes Mental spells hit harder, Strike of Flames makes divine spells and abilities hit harder, Strike of Corruption lowers the mobs wisdom alot those debuffs along side with our normal debuffs help the encounter die quicker and lets your guild get high ass numbers on the parse. So us DPS'sing actually helps the raid to DPS more. Thats enough incentive for me to keep dps'ing when the situation is willing.

Fritzzz · 03-30-2008, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoic

Scourging makes Mental spells hit harder, Strike of Flames makes divine spells and abilities hit harder, Strike of Corruption lowers the mobs wisdom alot those debuffs along side with our normal debuffs help the encounter die quicker and lets your guild get high ass numbers on the parse. .

Yes and the spell versions debuff for more than the CA versions. You can't get 2.5-4k dps with spells -- well I can't. I've not invested my DKP in caster gear over the years. If your using CAs instead of spells then your technically making other classes that have spells of the debuff dmg types do LESS dps -- ur basically stealing some of their DPS .

Like i said -- we can still pull 1k dps pretty easily and just spam heal. -- sure could even do more than 1k pretty easily if u have even basic caster gear-- but that menas ur spaming spells more so than spamming heals which leads to...

how much DPS does the other 5 people in your group lose when you go in full DPS mode? Since our buffs are not what they used to be, is it just better to spam your AOE heals and get the +150-+200 spell/CA dmg on people. -- i know there are caps but i've notice this spell increase group overall dps more so than keeping Devotion up. (btw devotion triggers it-- so i just toggle it on and off when it's up to cause group to get the buff more--lol our "uber endgame" buff is now just a trigger chance)
-- given No raid makeup is the same, no night do people play exactly the same, so I will be the first to agree maybe I just got bad data-- it's a possibility.

So basically effects on treasured gear > staple INQ spells.
-- seems kind of fucked up to me.

Smelzlikcheeze · 03-31-2008, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoic

I am a big fan of Legos, and because of that I think alot of pieces coming together even tiny pieces make for a great work of art or fun. Now maybe we only do 2.5k to 4k dps depending on the situation and gear. My guild doing 102k dps wouldn't be possible without my little contribution. A few times we have come a couple k away from hitting 120k dps. If everyone is working together including the priests we can get those numbers.

I think you might be more concerned with our own personal dps and not the raid as a whole. I have always been interested in my own dps but that doesn't make the "raid" good. Putting forth our contribution on the fights that we can be part of in a melee sense doesn't mean it isn't any less of a contribution. Yeah our assassin does 9-10k by himself which is downright sick, but it doesn't make my 3k not help with the overall dps. I guess we just can't be selfish anymore about being able to get on the parse. They would have to create a weapon that would allow us to be better than others and not an ability.

Back in KOS Vrak club and 100% crit were fricken amazing cause %crit gear was so rare. Now if a melee class has less than 50% in a raid they are slacking. Not to mention Double Attack gear and the sheer fact scouts and fighters have a base % more damage with the same weapon than we get. A brawler using a vrak club in the day could outdo our dps easily without 100% melee crit. The thing is Gear now a days has overshadowed most of our buffs from giving us that edge that we used to have. Yea we can self buff pretty well and junk but the idea that we are gonna actually compete on the DPS parse where the lowest person is sitting at 5.5k is ludicrous. Next expansion everyone will have 75% self buffed melee crit and shortly after that they will create a melee crit diminishing returns because they don't know how to compensate for it, thus making our STA line a joke cause you will then need 300% melee crit to actually have 100 melee crit. Its all a big cluster fuck to be honest. But to get back to the point at hand.

No we will never be able to compete with competant players on high end raid content nor will our DPS be that impressive anymore either. I however still think it helps the raid as a whole. Scourging makes Mental spells hit harder, Strike of Flames makes divine spells and abilities hit harder, Strike of Corruption lowers the mobs wisdom alot those debuffs along side with our normal debuffs help the encounter die quicker and lets your guild get high ass numbers on the parse. So us DPS'sing actually helps the raid to DPS more. Thats enough incentive for me to keep dps'ing when the situation is willing.

Not to seem like a naysayer here but on what mob are you parsing 100k on?

Stoic · 03-31-2008, 12:53 PM

We parse consistently 100k+ on yellow con mobs in Pawbusters and Overking. Tomb of thugga has too many control effects and same with Protectors Realm, obviously Chamber of Destiny and VP would be exceedingly difficult to do it there due to current orange mechanics, but on those mobs we hit around 80-90k on a good day consistently.

I understand ya being skeptical of it, but I assure ya I am not trying to pump up my ego or make my guild look better than it is. I just assumed alot of high end guilds were getting those numbers.

Leorra · 03-31-2008, 04:18 PM

This thread kinda confuses me.

Are you sying that you consider yourself a dps class? and want to know if you should start healing?

If you truly are a endgame raider it should be fairly obvious when you should be hardcore dpsing and when you shouldnt.

ie 1st wing vp trash that your mt defiler pretty much solo heals...you better be adding your 2-3k dps to raid cause its freaking trash and who doesnt want to get threw the trash as fast as possible right? No manaical infusion proc is gonna match that dps fyi.

I may be off base Im not sure what the exact intent of this thread is but inquis is a versatile class so be versatile. Why limit yourself to IM dps, or IM a healer. Just be whatever you need to be when you need to be it.

Because we can.

IMO if you were ever 2nd-5th on your dps parse people were slacking.

arturos · 03-31-2008, 05:50 PM

this is what i love about the inquis class.. We are not the top parsers in either area..
but you try to get those top numbers without our class in your raid...
ya go ahead try it i dare ya...

Smelzlikcheeze · 03-31-2008, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoic

We parse consistently 100k+ on yellow con mobs in Pawbusters and Overking. Tomb of thugga has too many control effects and same with Protectors Realm, obviously Chamber of Destiny and VP would be exceedingly difficult to do it there due to current orange mechanics, but on those mobs we hit around 80-90k on a good day consistently.

I understand ya being skeptical of it, but I assure ya I am not trying to pump up my ego or make my guild look better than it is. I just assumed alot of high end guilds were getting those numbers.

DAMN that is impressive. Im not trying to be an asshat im just trying to figure out why our guild is struggling to do half that dps. Do most of your members have mytical <---- lol mytical weapons? In your opinon without giving away strats how are you all doing this? Group setup? Certain class's? Please share with me so i can get better.

Fritzzz · 04-01-2008, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leorra

I may be off base Im not sure what the exact intent of this thread is but inquis is a versatile class so be versatile. Why limit yourself to IM dps, or IM a healer.
Because we can.

The point is our dps role is quickly getting obsoleted due to the fact dps ceiling is increasing by such a large # to make our dps mode pointless-- thus not versatile at all?

In EoF a good DPS class player could parse 3 to 4.2k. Now the same players ( I'll admit such capable players seem rare on my server--but their are a few) can parse 7-9k.

Their DPS almost doubled in one Expansion.

Our DPS on the other hand (pure dps mode) increased by maybe a 1400 ( I don't know about u guys but i could do 2-2.4k dps in EOF )?

Do you not see the point that eventually if that trend continutes then we lose this versatileness your talking about?

Also I don't really think you read all the points, because even going DPS mode comes at a cost of costing other classes in your raid to do less DPS. We are not versatile at all in my view, or if we are it comes at a retarded cost. We currently marginally augment other classes due to dps/haste inflation, we can heal decently but what healer can't?

What does inquisitor have that can't be replaced by another non-inq healer. I'd have to argue nothing much at all. We have debuffs-- which of course I use-- but I am unsure exactly how effective they are, and we have Inquisition which is nice but not required for anything.

Does this versatile you speak of mean we become great at nothing and slowly lose our middle ground range due to increased Damage caps and gear that obsoletes our usefulness? That does not sound versatile to me it sounds like we become obsolete fairly quickly.

arturos · 04-01-2008, 03:24 PM

I dunno if you feel that way sounds like u are halfway out the door already. i guess only thing left to say is dont the door hit ya where the good lord split ya...

I will agree with ur math on the dps numbers but jesus man stop being so damn emo over it, out of the healing classes the only other class that can compare to our dps numbers (imho of course no serious research) is a fury.

I could be wrong in this but meh.. just betray already if you think its that bad.