Blanka

For the record on beta I created every monk thread but one. I watched you jump on them one after another like you are doing now. And as far as lying, I don't do that shit, what exactly is there to lie about? Bruiser > Monk that is a fact you can spin it anyway you like it in your pea sized brain but it isn't going to change the fact. BTW, Vendetta? I was in it for not even a month it sucked hard I left. I wasn't even a member so get your facts right dumbass. There were some good players but it was constant 2-3 groups at raid time and the fucking raid leader was MIA half the time. You wanna talk facts every single person I have guilded with that was in Elysium said you were a little emo fuck who absolutely sucked at your class.

__________________

gungo

1) You can get a 10% hate transfer raidwide which will negate any difference in tautn values between classes.

I want the same boost every other fighter got. If monks recieved a 4.0 proc and keep thier haste from live. Then bruisers should get at minimum a 6.0 ppm to balance the gains. If monks received a 1.8ppm in mid stance and keep thier haste then bruisers should get a 2.8ppm. If monks recieved a 10ppm for a much higher amount of hate. then bruisers should recieved a 10ppm for thie rmuch smaller amount of hate/damage.

Ya every fighter got nerfed dps in defenisve that still doesnt make shit right that bruisers get an additional nerf to dps in defensive by nerfing our damage and proc rate.

You talk about this imbalance between monk and bruiser dps well bruisers already lost the option of using their damage/hate proc on test. In addition to the nerfs to proc rates and being completely left out of dps upgrades given to everyother fighter. This is not just a dps upgrade to monks either so you can cut the poor pitty monk crap. Guards, crusaders even zerks recieved substantial dps boosts in these changes. The only fighter basically nerfed in these changes was bruiser.

Mimn

No those values are on just the skills no buffs no modifiers i used a level 1 toon to look at them. (( i did this so that it would be fair as a base as i have a 80 monk too so things would be a bit off for the monks)) These are the base values for both classes moron. Take a level 1 class any and look at the values and you will see what i posted.

Look at what they are doing they are making a split in how the classes are played. Bruisers they are basing more on taunts while with monks they are basing them off them hitting the mob. Trust me i would rather have a taunt system then base mine off procs to keep agro.

You want the better taunts and the better proc. You are not looking at the full picture you are looking at one of the agro tools and crying foul when you have others that are better. Sorry your arguement has minimal value as you are not looking at it all. I even said really for what it looks like soe is doing that the taunt values for the bruiser should be enhanced. Its not the same system monks need that high proc rate plus being forced to take wis line to have a chance at holding aoe agro. Your aoe agro is based on much stronger taunts.

Lets put this into a case IF you had a equal proc taunt to a monk you would have better or equal single target agro and MUCH better aoe control. Tell me where that is fucking fair? You are an ass and for once i agree with Blanka you are a whiney bitch

Also Yes will say that you said 8 ppm in offensive not 10 but either which way its a joke. How can a fully properly buffed monk beat a fully buffed bruiser. And dont give me the haste item shit having to saccrifice stats.. there is a couple of new ones i have seen that are 3crit 35 haste or more. So its not like you are giving up alot to have a haste item.

My math doesnt add up a high haste bruiser you claim to be should have similar auttoattack damage to a monk while hey you can get another 100-200 ca damage mod on gear and it means alot more because your ca's hit harder. And hey with how crits now work with CA's add in the higher plus CA guess what you are doing more dps. I am sorry but i dont buy the bullshit you are spewing that the proc to monks is unfair and you deserve the better. You saw what monks got to HELP them bridge the gap a lil and cried foul. I hope that the devs realize that and just ignore you.

__________________

gungo

I wish i sucked at my class then they could find a bruiser to replace me. Instead the last 3+ years in this guild we haven't found a brawler that's worth keeping other then couching. If you actually knew anyone who was guilded w me that was not a complete dipshit. You would know i try to sit out of raids as much as possible, but guess what i keep getting pulled into raids to tank shit or dps over other fighters/scouts. I suck so bad at my class that we have had 6+ brawlers in 3 years I helped recruit that didn't make the cut and was booted from guild. Keep lying there joe dirt, your white trash lies ain't got shit on me.

and on the threads on beta i never once said anything about not fixing monks or nerfing monks or argued about monk issues. What i told you on those threads which you contiinue to do is to stop trying to nerf bruisers to fix your class or lying about bruiser abilites to fiix your class. In each of the threads you create you spewed some bullshit about how bruiser abilites was 100% avodiance abilities and stone skins procing all the time. When the fact was at that time those abilites didnt work. It wasnt until the last week or 2 of beta those AA's were fixed at the same time as the monk abilites btw.

So yes your still a lying peice of shit player. You keep making shit up because you are to stupid to know how the game works. Just liek in this thread where you clearly stated dps buffs are better for a bruiser then monk. You are either lying or stupid and don't know shit about the game. It's your choice. What are you a moron or liar.

gungo

If you are going to take everything into consideration then take everything into consideration. How much aoe agro does a 10% agro siphon on a fully buffed warlock provide. Apparently its alot considering every other siphon in game was removed except yours.

You claim bruisers will have higher single target agro with equal procs as monks yet the number you provided show higher single target taunts to monks. Keep talking about fair and yet you clearly have the advantage right now in both single target and aoe agro. In both dps and hate. Right now there is no balance. Comparing every stance side by side, monks are ahead by a large margin. I rather be a whiny bitch then a fucking hypocrit.

Mimn

Yeah that is dependant on the mage going max every time doesnt factor in if the mage rips or dies due to an aoe or gets resisted that the value fluxuates while you have a fixed hate gain.

Ummm how does monks have better aoe skills? your aoe taunts are double what a monks is and guess what your aoe taunts work on single targets too so our bigger single target taunts are countered by your larger aoe taunts. look at them god you are ignorant. your group taunt is as strong as our single taunt and your group aoe is as strong as our kick taunt. We have without the procs half the aoe agro and very close to the same single target agro generation. Look at it all god you are really dense. You have much better aoe taunts and over a group encounter that is gonna make much more agro for you.

I said in my last post if they made the proc rate the same you would have equal single target and much better aoe agro then the monks. So what according to you if they did that you would have equal or better agro control on about everything. I am not the one being a ingnorant ass here you are

__________________

Couch

I believe that bruisers get less hate proc in defensive stance is based on the design intention, aoe tank has to be worse on single target agro than single target tank.

For the avoidance buff, only lv32 avoidance can be M2 and it didn't make sense to use it since the rate is onl 34% vs lv60 avoidance 54%. The extra 1% hate transfer isn't going to cover the lose of successful rate.

For comparison, 9% hate transfer vs 16% hate gain and 5% dehate, in group instances, bruiser is better. It's simple, yours works on whole group. You can have more than 1 aoe dper and monk hate transfer works on single player.

In raid, 5% dehate on whole raid and 16% hate for all tanks is much better than 9% hate siphon on single player. It's trivial.

gungo

You can say that siphon values fluctuates all you want but anyone who has ever played with a paladin knows how wrong you are.

A monk has better aoe agro by using thier siphon. Its like saying a paladin on live has worse aoe agro then other fighters becuase you do not want to include amends. Its bullshit and you know it. The marginal difference in tuants does comapre to 10% of another classes hate. You keep saying i am dense yet your the one cherry picking abilites to compare. Again stop being a fuckign hypocrit.

What kind of retarded math do you use. If a monk and bruiser have the same proc rate and the monks hate proc is larger and thier single target taunts are larger then the bruiser how the fuck do you come to the conclusion that bruiser will have more single target agro? No my friend you are being completely ignorant.

gungo

There is alot to consider on when to use the m2 and not to. If your avoid buff is on another tank then you are not worried about your own hate transfer and want the most avodi possible for the other tank. If you have it on a dps class to increase your agro and lessen thiers. Then i would use the lower level buff. In this case its a 10% agro gain for you and a 10% agro loss for that particular dps class. In this case it is better for you to use the lower level m2. I would not say i would never use it becuase it is a lower level spell.

The 16% taunt and 5% deagro works on all fighters. Most bruisers do not use the deagro raid wide becuase its a waste of AA points. Maybe if agro becomes fucked it will be worth it after lu 51 at the cost of another AA. The good thing is 16% taunt and 5% deagro helps the monk as much as it helps a bruiser in raids. Whereas the siphon is a direct agro tool for the monk. Personally i havent seen the difference with the taunt adjuster maybe after lu 51 it will make a difference. While the 2 raidwides are better raid utility the transfer is a much better agro tool then the raidwides fro the monk. In a group i would rather lower the hate gain of the highest dps class by 10% and increase my agro by that 10% then lower the entire groups agro by 5% and increase my taunts by 16%.

Mimn

Ok i have a 9% hate siphon you have a 5% groupwide and raidwide deagro so comparing the 2 i have really a 4% hate gain on a single target over what a bruiser has. Also You have that large hate gain which will add agro to all your taunts which I dont have. That doesnt mean we have better aoe agro control. If you believe that then the only person you are kidding is yourself.

Also you are missing my point your group aoe taunt is just as strong as our single target taunt. When you factor in that hate gain you have for your taunts it makes that so much more. So yes without the procs you are gonna have near similar single target agro gains while you have much better aoe agro. 4% of real differnce isnt night and day like you claim it is. Also here is the other thing you are not factoring in in test taunts can crit with the int line. My xfer doesnt crit. You dont like it but the devs on this with the monk and bruiser balance have it pretty damn balanced and they have thought though it.

__________________