Please help me to understand this.

Aviendha · 02-13-2009, 09:10 AM

So I have had this issue in my guild Im trying to workout. Namely being booted out of OT group for an alt defiler or lesser skilled player for a defiler. Is this the norm? Am I being silly. Ive tried to read alot of the differences between the 2 so I can gauge the differences and why exactly a defiler is needed here and there for example. Can anyone help with this?

This isnt at all meant to be a knock at defilers, as I think both shamans are amazing. Im just trying to understand, so I at least myself will be happy with the slots Im put in and I understand them to the best of my ability.

There is a post in the eq2player mystic forums about using a mystic in MT group. After reading that my general consensus is, a defiler is put in MT group because basically they have no beneficial buffs over a mystic in any other group but MT. Whereas a mystic has beneficial buffs for melee classes for example. Also the general consensus was, the better player whether a mystic or defiler was placed in mt group.

Ive played a defiler off and on as I leveled my mystic as I betrayed her back and forth for various reasons. I also have a defiler on pvp server that is level 50, so I can see what buffs they have etc. What I keep getting told is hitpoints (which doesnt seem to be more than 150-200pt difference) and Tendrils (which is the buff that is put on the tank that debuffs on hit). Is this the whole reason? Because 150-200 hps doesnt seem like it is something that will save a tank that has over 20k.

It seems that mystics, from comparing with the defiler in our guild has larger wards in general than a defiler (although a defiler seems to have that heal portion to theirs. I know my single target ward is somewhere around 500-600 higher depending on gear over the defiler. and my group is only maybe 200-300. Both are master level. I assume this is a result of our mythical that gives us a boost to wards by 30% of our wisdom.

Also I dont really think it is my skill. I think Im pretty good at playing my class. I can solo heal every single TSO zone and solo heal my group in raid without a problem. Ive kept tanks up when alot of times honestly the defiler hasnt.

Im also not trying to boot anyone out of MT group. My issue is getting booted out of OT group for an alt or placed in a crappy whatever group all the time because they are trying to run 2 defilers. Im just trying to prevent me getting upset or taking this personal. So I would like more understanding or explanation is all.

Thanks so much.

Zaneluke · 02-13-2009, 09:28 AM

I would ask you raid leader why. In very simple terms it could be that you are needed in the group you are being sent to. Are you being sent to a group that lacks in disease poison resists?

I would just ask the raid leader. Some people are dead set in the group set up following a pattern that they like no matter if skill and spell line up says otherwise.

KFizzle · 02-13-2009, 11:01 AM

Well, being that i myself recently had this happen Avi, I can empathize. At first i took it personal for a few, but i quickly got over it as I understand why (not just for our guild, but in general, cause our 2nd defiler was a returning player). There's a few other benefits to a Defiler, near unlimited power, that soul ward, and to me the one thing i reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallly wish we as mystics had is the ability to cure yourself when stunned/stifled like they can.

Most of our benefits are 'raid wide', like Bolster, Stoicism, and Sentry ... Plus you gotta remember that with the way they game has pushed us towards being melee based (which i'm glad for :-) ) we would be even more beneficial in a melee DPS group (which is where i am). I get crazy DPS buffs so that makes me happy, and then my group gets all our buffs, and savage healing and our dog buff are nice cause most people in the group are right there next to me meleeing the mob.

Malachani · 02-13-2009, 11:21 AM

I've been swapped all over the place in my raid, but usually end up in the mage group. The one and only time I actually questioned my placement was when, after over a month straight, they put me in another group that wasn't OT group, and put the other mystic in the mage group where I normally was. I was given a very reasonable answer to my "WTF" lol! So don't be afraid to ask, just don't come in guns blazing demanding an explanation. Just simply ask what benefits they perceive with the move (either you buffing the "whatever" group or the defiler providing more to the OT).

And most of all, don't take it personally! Of all the raid leaders I've known (we actually cycle through them so no single person gets burned out) none have moved a person from one group to another because they didn't like them.

Its usually for the overall benefit of the raid.

KFizzle · 02-13-2009, 11:38 AM

I was in the mage group once ... it was weird and sucked (for me), the group was fine but i hated it. To be in the mage group full time like Mami there, i would definitely have to respec and use different gear ... so i guess i took the move to the melee group even better.

Aviendha · 02-13-2009, 01:03 PM

Thank you guys. That is very helpful and makes me feel better. I've actually asked a couple of times why. The main reason I get is hitpoint buffs and tendrils. I was also told last night..that if they have a chance for a defiler and temp on a tank then that is what they prefer. I guess I just feel that other than a mob that stuns..there isn't much difference. And at this point the whole defiler thing is just because anymore. That that is just the way it is without regard to changes that have occured in the last couple of expansions. Either way. I guess it doesn't matter. I was told it wasn't at all personal. So ill just have to take it as that.

Saracen · 02-13-2009, 01:04 PM

sometimes a mage group simply needs the extra hp + wards. but as for being in a pure mage group full time. I would probably quit. our raid setups tend to be very 'hybrid' anyway so I only really QQ when I dont get a dirge.

as for defiler mystic thing I would argue that a defiler is well suited to offtank or mage group unless there is a control effect ae tbh.

I would even argue that once a tank has enough procs that we add a lot more than a defiler can to his survivability with our proc booster! one time we even ran with defiler/mystic/templar and I really enjoyed that. the tank just simply never leaves 100% lol

Kaizer_Sosay · 02-13-2009, 01:54 PM

I skimmed through this reading quickly. I dont think anyone mentioned the new overpowered buff Defiler's Spiritual Shrine just got. Fucking things cast raidwide 1k wards now. Give or take exact numbers on that, our defilers love it.

But in general our cross raid abilities let us heal anygroup easily. I'll solo heal a dps group while cycle ST wards/heals on the offtank(cleric/druid healers). To me its more fun outside the tanking groups.

Aviendha · 02-13-2009, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaizer_Sosay

I skimmed through this reading quickly. I dont think anyone mentioned the new overpowered buff Defiler's Spiritual Shrine just got. Fucking things cast raidwide 1k wards now. Give or take exact numbers on that, our defilers love it.

But in general our cross raid abilities let us heal anygroup easily. I'll solo heal a dps group while cycle ST wards/heals on the offtank(cleric/druid healers). To me its more fun outside the tanking groups.

I agree on being outside of mt group it can sometimes be more fun..but I do really like OT group. When MT goes down we are there to pick it up. As far as the defiler spiritual circle..I agree that thing is good. I wish they would make our lunar attendant more similar..id be happy if it just healed for more actually :/

Kaizer_Sosay · 02-13-2009, 04:40 PM

just make it raidwide like the spiritual circle. the 300 raidwide heal would be nice