Originally Posted by Wiz

Sorry, I'm not willing to accept there are 10 correct answers to this puzzle. There are simply an awful lot of incorrect mystics out there guessing at shit and calling it good enough.

Thanks for chiming in your 'give up it's useless' message, but I'm not giving up

Originally Posted by Wiz

I know for a fact the people who say "I try for a balance of all that" are dead wrong. There has to be a factual better statistic than the others (to some curve or cap), they can't all 4 be 'the same' in value.
On the contrary, until the cap (or caps on abilities), there ARE multiple stats that deliver the same average healing. E.g. if you take single target ward into account: for you the base is 2535, assuming 15% bonus on a crit (this is likely not correct considering gear and AA's, but bear with me)
Base: 2535
Crit: 2915(.25) ~ 2915

Heal Crit:
So if you have 50% heal crit
2535*(50%) + 2915*(50%) = 1267.5 + 1457.5 = 2725 Average ward

+Heals (no heal crit):
So if you have +190 Heals, and 0% heal crit, your average ward will be 2535 + 190 = 2725 Average Ward

+Heals (20% heal crit):
So if you have 20% heal crit, and +111 heals, your average ward will be
(2535 + 111)*(80%) + (2535 + 111)*1.15*(20%) = 2725 Average Ward

This is a set ratio between Heal crit and +Heals (1:3.8) BUT this changes depending on which heal spells you cast most often!!!

A. +Heal: We know this stat is capped at 50% of the base value of the heals it may apply towards, so this gives us a variety of numbers based on each heal separately, not one total number. We know that fury mythicals can give us monster boosts in this area. If you're not the MT shaman or in a raid with 2 furies, though it seems this isn't a buff Mystic's can count on. So, at what point do we get diminishing returns?

I also believe that any modifier for base heal (such as the TSO forearms) which offer "+2 base heal" improve the ranges of each heal and that DOES get included in the +heal cap.
Correct
Here are some screenies:

BASE:

CAPPED:

CAPPED AFTER +10%-11% BASE:

When capped, 3008 is the max value, which is 2005*1.5; after 10-11% to base heals

Cap is now at 3309. (2005*1.1)*1.5 ~= 3309
So the +base heal amount does extend cap on +heals

Questions:
1. Do +base heal mods affect like I'm stating here? Yes
2. The Mystic Mythical takes 30% of wisdom (apparently uncapped as I've seen it increase up to 1500 wisdom already), does this 30% impact like a 'base' increase pushing our upper range of +heal benefit to monsterous numbers? Doh! Forgot to check this


B: Heal Crit: Already discussed

C. Cast Speed. Now I start to get pretty fuzzy. Someone explained to me that the max cast speed buffing you can get is 50%. So every heal you cast HAS to take half of it's original time no matter what and that's it's cap. With Alendine and recast timers on a variety of gear pieces I seem to be able to get to about 45% cast time reduction and the statistics inside each heal or spell upon examine do indicate the improvement.

Obviously a shaman has to anticipate incoming damage with wards since they need to be ON the player taking damage BEFORE the damage hits. So casting speed frees you up to get more spells cast into a given time frame. I would guess that if I can cast 45% faster (assuming unlimited power) then I could heal 45% more in a pressurized situation assuming my reuse timers allowed spells to be available as often as I could use them. I find with 45% cast speed that I can cast faster than my heals are available. This allows me plenty of time to work in debuffs so it's not all bad, but I think in my formula of priorities I'm going to aim for 30% cast speed as the biggest curve until it starts to have diminishing returns.
Profe talked about this already, 100% is the actual cap, I'm sitting at "53%" self buffed and not capped, as with TC or UT I cast even faster. But even at 53% I do not run out of heals or CA's or Debuffs or hearts/shards/manastone.

Questions:
1. Is there a point where cast speed is NOT helpful? For example if a spell is 1.5s cast vs. 1.3s cast - can I do anything with that .2 seconds or is that wasted time in game ticks? The .2 sec can add up, if you cast that spell 15 times per minute, then that allows you to save 3 sec, or enough time cast another group ward or refresh your debuffs. You have at least 4 damage spells you can cast, 5 debuffs, 3 legit wards and 3 at least semi-legit heals, as well as 3 temp buffs/pets so you should not run out of stuff to cast
2. Is there any negative at all to faster casting?? Quick power loss. If you have a manastone and power potions and hearts/shards and power roots and an enchanter/bard, this shouldn't pose a problem.

D. Reuse Timers: Again, a fuzzy area - but I'm given to understand that 50% is the cap in this area as well. The more often your spells are available the more you'll be able to use them, so I'm very clear on the concept, but how the hell do we VALUE this vs. anything else? I think of all the categories this is one I have such a horrible time placing data. I can put together a heal chain and sample timer of what order things should be cast based on power and heal efficiency but then I can't factor in how things like needing to cure in between casts or interrupting casts to cure or spam curing for a few seconds at a key moment or curing a curse that randomly hits my grp affects and changes that heal and debuff routine.
Again, depends on your casting order and style, if you sit waiting for your wards to refresh this is for you, otherwise you can crank out some DPS or extra debuffs (if fighting multiple mobs) while your spells cool down.


And mixed into ALL of that - are healing procs... I think I'll make heal gear per slot a separate post - because some procs probably become #1 on this list and you'll simply wear the massive 2-3 pieces of gear and work all of the other stats AROUND that item.

Thoughts absolutely appreciated and requested. Again, please try to keep out the opinion. I'm 100% sure given the fact this game's underlying surface is a computer which calculates numbers that if we dig deep enough and figure out the right ways to test we can find the math priorities for our class.
Read my other post http://www.eq2flames.com/mystics/477...mod-mia-4.html

Originally Posted by nyquist

Originally Posted by Jenya

I AM SAYING, everyone is right. As long as you set out to accomplish what you went to do you are 120% correct.
Lol, I meant if you rely on gear and AA specs that are retarded like INT AA's + rez&cure AA's only + AGI gear and +Subjugation and +Aggression gear while trying to heal and shit like that, and you only cast your non-profession heals and overwrite your own dots and debuffs when they have 90%+ left to tick, and you keep letting your group die, you are NOT right. You can still survive with a shitty set up, you just won't be getting much out of your gear/AA/spells, however:

If you build yourself to steal the MT spot, then I say FUCK YEAH YOU WIN, if you do. If you set up to be an OT/DPS (like myself) and you can go from kicking out a few K in dps to having to take over the fight as a full blown healer then, FUCK YEAH YOU WIN!!!!! If you opt to be a mage/dps group healer and wanna blow out huge dps and rely on proc to keep a minimal inc dmg group alive and put up some nice numbers, THAN FUCK YEAH YOU ALSO WIN. Our class is truely trial and error based on what you do, starting small and working into a groove is what is it all about.
This should be the mystic class' motto imo.
...

Originally Posted by nyquist

Originally Posted by Wiz

though I'm still confused on what the tooltip doesn't show correctly. Is it just recast/cast timers that it's fouled up with?

Originally Posted by Wiz

That's pretty amazing, really - almost a 4 to 1 ratio favoring +heal.....

Originally Posted by profe

Pay more attention since I said that in a previous post already with "... 4 heal mod > 12 wisdom > 1% crit chance."