Raiding Mystic Thread

[Gisallo]

Originally Posted by Arcanemundi

Nope.


Gear choices are hard to advise on since every raider have different guild levels and run through different zones. If you are raiding TSO, and it is a tradeoff between the Star of Malice and Arm of Erolsi, I would probably lean toward the Star of Malice for most fights. Those Angels are awesome. Plus Claymore is a tough quest series to complete, especially now that most raiders are in RoK or TSO, and not raiding KoS anymore. Although, I think we basically 1 1/2 grouped Deathtoll in my last guild for updates and AA.

I used to wear all those base increasing items, but after testing them out and thinking about it more, they all now seem less valuable to me. Most fights where you would really need 20% bigger wards, you will already be spamming all your heals anyways. This would increase the amount of average heals cast per minute, and decrease the actual amount of heals effected by the procs. So having a random heal or ward every 30 seconds be 20% bigger is not going to be noticed much at all. Plus, if you divide out the heal mod increase over all spells cast in that 30 seconds you will find that the base increasing proc effects only equal a small amount of mod on average. I guess if random spike damage is a concern, you might get lucky, but the chance are very slim that you will get a spike hit and a proc at the same time.

Thanks for the info Arcane, I was thinking the same in so far as the Totem vs the rolling pin. Btw I was not thinking about replacing the star, I love the angels...if I ever got the Arm it was going into the ranged slot instead of this \aITEM 1978585608 1204260724:Symbol of Najenaar Dominance\/a. I am still gearing out t4 wise so thats the best ranged slot item I have atm. I think I may just stick with that though rather than bribing friends for a drunken KOS raid night.

[Arcanemundi]

Originally Posted by Xrath

No arm procs a lot more, regardless on weather they both proc wards / heals, the Arm procs of ANY beneficial, that includes buffs, temp pets, cures, short term buffs. While the rolling pin only procs of healing spells. As well the arm procs more time per minute if you inspect it

Your right of course about the Arm of Erolsi proccing as a result of cures and buffs and heals, unlike how the Totem and Pin proc off of only heals. But that does not mean it will proc more of the time.

What I was getting at in my previous post was if you tested the items you would find that the effect procs around every 25-30 seconds on average. So, unless you don't regularly cast wards and heals as much as you do cures and buffs, there will be little difference in how many times the Arm procs compared to the Pin or Totem.

[Arcanemundi]

[Chidori]

Arcanemundi,

You may want to highlight the parts that actually refer to the proc we care about. As you can see, the arm does proc more than the pin.


But ignoring trigger chance in the window and focusing on the trigger itself,

On the rolling pin...
When target casts a critical healing spell...

On the arm...
When target casts a beneficial spell...

Would not the arm proc more regardless of the proc rate in the examine window because of the fact the arm procs off any beneficial spell... not just criticals?
Of course the proc from the arm can be dispelled by any beneficial spell as well so you could blow the effect on a cure or temp buff cast.

[Arcanemundi]

Ooops, didn't notice the proc rate was different once you scrolled down. My bad. :p Damn, sorry about that.

The proc rate is a little higher, 2.0 compared to 1.8, or every 33 seconds instead of every 30 seconds (on average). What I have noticed when testing proc rates is there is some kind of mathematical balance for procs that is always active and keeping track of how much an effect actually procs. So, if you cast heals for say 10 minutes, you will see these 1.8 and 2.0 ratios materialize, but sometimes the proc will happen 3 times in a row, and sometimes it won't proc for more than 50 seconds. Over several minutes though the game balances the proc rate out. Since we usually spam wards and heals in heavy fights where these items matter more, the proc will occur regardless if you are casting just heals, or heals and cures. When the game thinks the item should proc, then your next cure or heal will make it proc, then there is another 30 second or so gap (on average.) I guess if your curing tons of effects all the time, and not healing as much then the Arm might be a bit better. Not sure how you could prove it with math though.

I think you can blow the base increase proc on a lot of things, not just cures. I'm not sure if they fixed it yet, but last time I checked I think it was being absorbed by Kindred Restoration and all Mana Well procs, so kinda a waste there too...

I don't know. If you don't have anything better like a +heal mod, or +haste, symbol/ranged/ear item, I guess they might be worth equipping.

[Arcanemundi]

Here's some data I accumulated a while ago:

1 of 3 tests (50 group wards spammed over 20 minute duration)

Format: Total Casts.....Per min rate.....%
22...1.10.....44% No Effect
5.....0.25.....10% Proc Animation but same size ward (Cure proc?)
5.....0.25.....10% Arm of Erolsi
8.....0.40.....16% Ferhustr's Furious Rolling-Pin
6.....0.30.....12% Totem of the Ankexfen
1.....0.05.....2% Arm of Erolsi and Rolling Pin
3.....0.15.....6% Arm of Erolsi and Totem
50...............100% Total

Pin 16% + 2% = 18% of wards effected
Totem 12% + 6% = 18% of wards effected
Arm 10% + 2% + 6% = 18% of wards effected (Same rate?!)

Pin .4/min + .05/min = .45 per min
Totem .3/min + .15/min = .45 per min
Arm .25/min + .05/min+.15/min = .45 per min (Same rate?!)

.45 per minute = 2.2 per minute (I had Ancestry Activated to get this rate)

I should also note I was at 100% heal crit so the pin had an equal chance to proc as the other items. If you had less than 100%, like 70-80% heal crit, then the Pin might proc less than the other items, but not much less.

[profe]

Originally Posted by Arcanemundi

I think you can blow the base increase proc on a lot of things, not just cures. I'm not sure if they fixed it yet, but last time I checked I think it was being absorbed by Kindred Restoration and all Mana Well procs, so kinda a waste there too...

I have noticed this as well, more with the Arm than the Totem because of how it gets dispelled. It seems to turn off from gear procs that can't be modified anyway, so it gets wasted. I did /feedback this ages ago asking to change it to dispel only on healing spells, though I suspect they like the way it is now.

So, even though the Arm may have a slightly higher chance to turn on, it isn't worth it because of the manner in which it turns off and other equipment choices for its slot (Symbol of the Faydark, Brace of Corporeal Darklight, Contained Idol of Void Mist, Trakanon's Gaze.)

[nubile]

disregard the question guess i could have hit a page back.

[Lessah]

Hi Im Lessa and I love this Raid thread ! Whoever did it... great job !

[Wiz]

omg, me too! I also love jelly donuts, do you?