stealthfighter

Euron, I agree with you that it would be pretty cool if the level lockers were at level 70. However, because of the time it takes to reach level 70, a lot of these level-lockers wouldn't be playing EQ2 if it wasn't for the ability to pvp at lower levels.

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LFG

I agree, I've asked him 3 times previously to post his fan site articles in the Fan Site section. This one has already gone too far to move there.

I'm losing my patience with this person, and been very nice about it to this point.

Stealthfighter, please do all future site whoring for your fan site in the Fan Site section. Not sure what can be confusing about this request.

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Morphous

2 types of level lockers.

1 = lvl 70 that has twinks at various levels to deal with little people that annoy him on his 70. These are fine. They aren't brought out that often and mostly just used to deal with fleas.

2 = The grade school bully who is too stupid to move on to the higher grades and compete with the kids his own age. As he continues to fail the 5th grade, he keeps getting bigger and stronger and the kids coming up are even more easy to pick on.

Odinn

At lvl 70, there is no one higher than you...lvl 70's are locked, many are Fabled/Mastered and kill greens all the time for status.

In T2, you are always green to someone....

LFG

I think EQ2 PvP would be far better if they simply removed the ability to turn off exp.

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Faabio

It's my understand that he suffers from Selective Reading Disorder.

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Paikis

1. Accessibility of PvP - Bullshit, level-locking BLOCKS casual players from PvP because they dont have the time to dedicate to getting the gear and masters to compete with the twinks. If there was no level-locking people would still level slower than on PvE servers because they understand that AA=good. This then means that there would still be PvP in all tiers. The only difference is that there wont be twinks there to completely destroy the non-twinks. Watched a level 12 templar kill 3 level 15 toons in darklight wood a couple days ago. 1 level 12 killed those 3 level 15s 3 times (they zerged him) Twinks are OPed and are BLOCKING your average joe from being able to participate in low-level PvP.

2. Tradeskilling - Again, Bullshit! The markets for T2 through T6 mastercrafted will still exist, because PvPers realise the importance of having good gear. Without that gear your toon is only sub-par, even with full masters. As for people not spending because they aren't staying in those tiers for long... see my last point about slower levelling.

3. Use of more content - Again, would still happen even if there were no level-lockers. Like you said, people are encouraged to hunt in every zone to get more AA. How does not locking your level mean you suddenly don't care about AA? Also, you know those other 50-odd levels you aren't using? Guess what, there's extra spells and abilities that YOU DONT HAVE in those levels. That is CONTENT THAT YOU AREN'T USING. Let's put some thought into your arguements before you post this drivel please.

4. Equipment strategy - The lockers aren't experiencing more of the game, they're experiencing more of THAT mob, you know, the one which drops that uber-1337 wrist piece that is so covetted by the lockers? Even if you said that the lockers experience more of the loot, I'd have to shoot that arguement down in flames as well. Lockers do not experience ANY of the game at all, beyond level 30-40. Solely because they ARE lockers, they dont experience the end-game, so they dont see most of the loot, they dont see most of the mobs, they dont do most of the quests. This arguement smells like week-old goat-shit that's been left to fester in a pool of water.

5. Proliferation of Alts. Again, having twinks DOES NOT create the need or want for alts. People create alts for a variety of reasons, and I'm willing to bet your life that the biggest reason is NOT so that they can twink out at level X and experience easy-mode 2-shot kills on n00bies. Me personally? I create alts so I can see how other classes are played, so I can experience more of the game content (cos you know, all those abilities the other classes have? All the ones your class has, but you never see cos you wont unlock? That's content.)

Overall, i rate this fan-site post as an F-. Absolute Bullshit. This post isn't even good enough to be used as toilet-paper in an out-back shit house that gets used once every 3 months. You are DEVALUING any piece of paper you print this trash on. Not a single relevant point about why level-lockers should be allowed to continue to play in easy mode. Not a single benefit to the economy that wouldn't be there anyways just from being players wanting good gear while they level. All-in-all this is a post designed to justify your want to be a play-ground bully in Norrath.

You sir suck.

Rating: 0/100 (If I could give you a negative, I would)

kaif

PWNED by Paikis

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stealthfighter

Paikis,

I understand your points here. The way I see it people who pvp in T7 are angry at the level lockers because it means less pvp at T7. I absolutely agree with you that healthy lower tier pvp does reduce the number of players at T7. However, most of the problems the are raised about lower tier pvp and level-locking also exist in T7. For example,

1. Accessibility of PVP - Casual players are also blocked from being effective at T7 pvp. For one, casual players have a hard time leveling a character to level 70. Unlike people who play for several hours a day, the casual player might only play for 30 minutes to 2 hours a day. Therefore, if the critical mass of players who are pvping are in T6 or T7, it will take the casual player forever to get to pvp consistently. In fact, many casual players never get to level 70. Should these players not get to experience great pvp action? I think that T7 pvpers are just diappointed with the number of people pvping at T7 and they are irrationally blaming the level-lockers.

Secondly, you mention that the twink level-lockers hurt the accessibility of pvp for casual players. I strongly disagree with this. Casual players have the ability to twink T2 and T3 characters very easily. However, gaining awesome gear at T7 is harder. Most casual players never experience a raid. This means that they will not be as well geared as the "hardcore" T7 pvpers. Therefore, the "twink" problem exists both in T2 and the T7 pvp.

2. Tradeskilling - I absolutely agree that there will still be a market for lower tier tradeskill items, but I guarantee that the market will be smaller. I know that I would never buy MC crafted T2 or T3 gear. I would just out level it too quickly.

3. Use of more content - You raise a good point about levels 30 - 70 having great content. But I think that a lot of level lockers are also experiencing this content with other characters. For instance, I have a toon for T2 pvp, T3 pvp and one for leveling up to 70. Most level-lockers are doing the same as I am. And guess what, as soon as I get to T7, I will pvp up there too. This is not an all or nothing thing. Instead the game experience is just more diverse.

4. Equipment strategy - As noted above, your argument assumes that level-lockers do not have other toons at higher levels. Additionally, many level-lockers would not ever experience raid content because of lack of time.

5. Easy Mode - One thing that I have noticed in a lot of the responses here against level-locking is that this is "easy mode." Or another often used comment is that people should level to level 70 to "play with the big boys." While I must admit that I do not have a level 70 character, my experience with EQ2 suggest that everything is "easy mode." Let's face it, this game is not that hard. I am glad that you are a "big boy," but I will have to face the reality of being a casual player due to my responsibilities of being a "grown man."

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Paikis

Stealthfighter@Nagafen wrote:

'Stuff' scroll up to read it. Long, nested quotes FTL!

In reply:
1. Accessibility of PvP - Casual players are not blocked from being effective at T7 PvP. The tokens system means that any time they get a kill, whether it's a bot or another player, they get tokens which go towards getting the best armor-set in the game (for Pvping in). If you don't beleive this, then take a look at the EoF Fabled set gear. Now take a look at the PvP set gear. Notice any similarities? Notice how the PvP gear is VASTLY superior (for the 4 classes I play anyways)? The casual player may not know that they NEED to twink in order to compete in T2/T3. If there were no twinks, and think about this, instead of just spouting the usual "But it's the same in T7" rubbish... if there were no twinks in T2/T3, then the lowbies wouldn't NEED to twink just to be able to kill a single green con. They wouldn't NEED to twink just to SURVIVE those first 3-4 arrows from that ranger. Infact, many new players never make it to level 20, because they get frustrated with being repeatedly killed by people who the con system says they should walk all over.

If the critical mass of PvPers was in T7, the newbies would be able to level in a relatively twink-free environment, where they would have a chance against other toons. In the end we'd have MORE players and MORE PvP in all level ranges. I think that T2/T3 PvPers (twinks) are strangling the supply of new toons to the server, thereby restricting the number of toons who make it to T7, CREATING the poor numbers of T7 PvPers which is the reason why the twinks say they exist in the first place. (Apparently. I don't believe it has anything to do with numbers, more to do with wanting to play easy-mode) Take away the twinks and you fix the problem that caused them in the first place. While I admit that good gear doesn't just drop into your lap upon hitting 70, it's ALOT easier to get PvP gear at 70 than it is to get it at level 20. By the time you have enough faction to be able to buy those level 20 PvP peices, you'd have got enough tokens for 2-3 peices of T7 gear. Instances can be ran just as easily in T7 as they can in lower tiers for gear. Using gearing up as a reason why twinks are a good idea is crap. It's a cop-out. It's like saying "I drink coke because the water bottles are stored one isle over from the coke and I don't want to walk that extra 3-4 meters." You don't want to drink coke because the water is on the next shelf/down the next isle. You drink coke because it tastes good. It screws your body, but it tastes good. It's the same with twinking. You don't twink because you can't compete in T7. You twink because it's EASY and because you like the feeling of power you get when you WIN. Just like the coke though, it's screwing the system you use to support it.

2. Tradeskilling - The market for T2/T3 tradeskilling will be smaller yes, but that's only 2 tiers. There's 4 (soon to be 5) more after that. Lessen 2 tiers worth of purchases in order to increase 5 more? Stopping twinking wont DECREASE the economy, it will actually INCREASE it, just not in T2/T3. Again, useless drivel with absolutely no truth behind it.

3. Use of more content - I guess I can't argue with that. I have toons in multiple tiers as well, none of mine however spend their entire life killing n00bies and discouraging them from playing. I don't cause anyone to leave the server (or perhaps the game) by playing my toons. Game experience is not more diverse. Lockers know where the good loot drops and make a bee-line for it. They dont run the instances so they can see more of the game, they run it so they can get the best peice of gear for that slot.

4. Equipment strategy - I really don't care if you're raiding or not. You do not need to raid in order to PvP, I was doing it with nothing but PvP gear and one peice (one) of Labs jewelery. The PvP weapons are nicer than the Labs-dropped weapons generally as well. I fail to see how having other toons at higher levels means you wont want to have good gear for your toon? Just because my main had good gear, that doesn't mean that all my alts level up in island gear. Having a higher level toon provides the lower level ones with coin, but the best gear often cannot be bought. Anyone who wanted better gear would still have to go farm it. But really, if no one could lock their experience and stay at one level forever, you wouldn't need better than mastercrafted, because no one would spend 2-3 weeks at one level farming for it.

5. Easy mode - I've never mentioned levelling up so you can play with the 'big-boys' and personally think it's a stupid phrase, as alot of the supposed 'big-boys' are just as childish as the twinks. Anyone who can't see that being able to kill people with 2-3 attacks is 'easy-mode' though needs to ahve their head checked. When a level 12 templar has such stupidly strong gear that he can kill 3 players that are 3 levels higher than him 3 times each and then survive to run away, there's a problem. When you can stand in the commonlands AFK and have people not be able to kill you, there is a problem. These uber-twinks are so decked out that you'd need a raid of 'average joe' toons to kill them. As for your comment of being a 'grown man' all I can say is yay for you. OK, so I'm a full-time student with no job. Ask my guild how many raid's Ive been on during the week while I'm at Uni (College), heck ask them how many time's they've SEEN ME LOG ON during the week. I'll bet you not one of them will be able to say they've seen me during the week. Having a paycheque doesn't mean the rules should be changed for you. Having a paycheque doesn't entitle you to drive away new players because they just have no chance. And NOT having a paycheque doesn't change the fact that I've countered every arguement you've put forward and shown how they're just plain wrong (point number 3. from above being the exception).

EDIT: Holy massive blocks of un-formatted text batman!! (Copy+paste FTW!)