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Old 01-11-2008, 12:48 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

Hmm I did a thread search and could not find this listed, but the initial post in this thread argued that Rangers provide nothing for a raid. There is Hawk Attack which siphons hate from a GROUP in a raid, which is something. Perhaps they could make this more effective?

And off topic, Vanguard has the best ranger (and bard) class. They are the best DPS class, as it should be.
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Old 01-11-2008, 01:07 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

The Hawk actually has to hit the mob to siphon that hate. Against level 85-86 orange con's it pretty much will never hit the mob. Making it just another useless skill like Stream of Arrows or since you play a swashy you're Hail of Steel.
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Old 01-14-2008, 06:14 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

Hex I know this is a late reply to that great post at the beginning of this thread, but better late than never right? :p

Couple of things out of the gate, your post that starts this thread is the most concise and acurate thread about rangers in EQ I have ever seen. To qualify that I have been playing a ranger since '98 (EQ) and now in EQ2, so riding the "they giveth and they taketh away" wave that sony keeps generating is nothing new.

Your statement about how PvP effects PvE in this game is bang on, I have said for years the only way to resolve it is to segregate them from each other entirely.

Also I have said many times, that all a ranger can offer a raid guild is pure DPS, we have nothing else to bring, and they have royally raped us right now. Not much point in me posting numbers or comparrisons because you've already done a bang up job of that.

For those who never played EQ, at least there they gave us a group buff, Howl of the Predator (I believe it was called), that was a +75 attack buff. Relatively to EQ2 that would be rather useless, BUT possibly they could consider something along the line of +DPS or +ranged/melee crit or DA. Granted this is something they should do as "tossing us a bone" for all the jerkin' around we put up with, but maybe its something.

In 9 years of playing the ranger class I don't think (truly) that SoE has ever really figured out what the class should be able to do or not do. At the bottom line all we are is DPS, so allow us to do so.

Regards, Vailenn
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Old 01-14-2008, 06:50 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

I'm new to the forums and EQII but I think I have found an issue here that may reflect the reason SOE screws with Rangers so bad (with the exception of the arrow mechanic issue which they acknowledge but don't really say they will fix, here's hoping)

I think they look at certain classes, Rangers included as soloing classes first.

They probably get whining from spell casters who say "they get chain armor, they get more hit points so they can live longer, I need to do more damage than them"

whining from the other scouts "they can do 80% of their damage from Range, I need to get up close and personal taking more risk, so I need to do more damage than them."

These would ALMOST be valid arguments, even in the group setting, if not only the arrow issue was fixed BUT they were free for Rangers, but they aren't we need to spend gold.

Additionally they neglect that this game is largely about team work. This being the case you form a team based on what it brings to the table and the other classes do bring more to the table outside of damage.

This came to a head for me the other day duoing with one of my Guildmates (also one of the first level 80 Furys on the server.) She is doing more than fair DPS, I don't even want to talk about the max damage that her "nuke" attacks do or the advantage that her lvl 80 spell, ball lighting brings, to the table. On top of this she invisis the entire party, heals, buffs and debuffs like gang busters, root and all that good stuff. She can do these things with even average to good equipment for her class. Now if I am the team leader of a group and have one slot left who am I going to chose? The Fury who is largely independant of her gear and can swap between offensive and support as the flow of battle dictates, or the Ranger who without luck, Plat or a Guild willing to give up the good gear, is going to be doing marginally better DPS (if he's lucky) but brings nothing else to the party?

I love my Ranger and he will ALWAYS be my Main regardless of the mechanics. I am on a Roleplaying server for a reason. Still it would be nice to be in a fight and not be saying "jeez when was the last time I, the class thats supposed to be ALL about damage, actually saw my name as the toon that killed the opponent", since doing damage is in theory what my Class is supposed to be about.

If my character was about other things too (like my Alt Dirge) I wouldn't care about it. When I play my Dirge I bring other things to the table. But since as a Ranger all I am bringing is my Bow and sword, its an issue I am flabergasted by the occassional Dev that pops over here to say "your good, with the POSSIBLE exception of the arrow issue." I don't know if they are clueless, have never actually played a Ranger from creation the hardway (having to earn your gear and gold), or simply have an overly defensive attitude and go on the atatck when they are critiqued.

Regardless I have to salute you on this initial post. It put things in a logical format which invite only 2 intelligent responses. A reasoned analysis that will result in change, or a complete dismissing of the post, to avoid having to admit to the problems, as they exist, were created by developers not fully reasoning out mechanical changes. That seems to be the way of developers though. In CoH they got complaints from non-tankers that Tanks were too, well, tankable, so they nerfed tanks and made them a class that you can do without. People began to turn to Controllers that indirectly manipulate and manage aggro and can buff the party to boot. There is a middle ground, but the powers that be never seem to find it.

Last edited by Gisallo; 01-14-2008 at 06:51 PM.
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Old 01-15-2008, 07:47 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

Appreciate the Kudos, ya'll could rate the post....

I'm going to try to contact the devs again and see if there's anything in the works or if we're just spinning our wheels some more.

Epic is going to be the big kicker for me...

-Hexus-

Last edited by Hexus; 01-15-2008 at 07:49 PM.
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Old 01-16-2008, 01:15 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

Don't get your hopes up heh. In EQ1 when they were designing epic 2, they originally had pictures for a bow. That turned into a 1h heh.

However it's possible that might have been a consensus from the ranger populace.

So either they don't give a shit, or they cave to whatever we want.
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Old 01-16-2008, 01:17 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

Don't expect a bow, and then you can't be disappointed.

If the epic fails, I will probably quit this game, at the very least as a ranger. That's not the only reason for me leaving but it would be the big assfuck cherry on top of this shit sundae I've been happily eating since T7 began.

meh

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Old 01-16-2008, 06:47 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

Guys, the epic swords in EQ1 (swiftwind & earthcaller) were quickly bettered, and really earthcaller with its root proc was not a friend in group or raid environment.

Any epic they give any class will eventually be outdone by something better. Like I said above they giveth and they taketh away, and with the ranger class since conception they have no true idea of what the fuck to do with us, I truly believe that.

For myself I would much rather they fix this bow & arrow mechanics fiasco, rebalance the hit % again and start putting some decent drops in the game that aren't one in a million or non existant for rangers.

The other thing that you touched on Hex, that I wish more people would get behind, is the effect PvP decisions have on PvE mechanics. Personally I have no time for PvP, hey it just ain't my cup of tea. They never blanced shit right from the get go in SWG, trying to blance these 2 venues, they learned nothing from that failure, and are still trying to get it right here. 9 years (since I started in EQ) and they still haven't figured this shit out, any of it, they have no clear idea imho wtf to do with the ranger class.

Stupid me I just keep riding the waves because the ranger is what I really want to play, and I continue to hold hope that some x-ranger will be hired as a dev or something happens that corrects the path. You have to believe that somewhere along the line they decided we should be an awesome DPS force, because they sure as hell never gave us any other capabilities. From there I don't think they have ever figured out how to do it right. Anytime we get close either our own community or the PvP community gets a hard on about it, and BAM we get adjusted down again. The part that really boggles me is in a PvE raid guild environment why do other classes bitch when we're riding the high end of the parse all the time. Thats what we're supposed to do, stfu and be happy we're doin it!
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Old 01-16-2008, 06:52 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

The longer it takes for epics to come out, the more useless they become. We only have so much time before the next tier comes out, rendering what we have now completely redundant.

In theory, fucking VP loot.

Regardless, if they are planning on implementing a new tier in the next expansion, I would hold off on epics until then. If they plan to be flurby RP mother fuckers and bring out epics soonish to keep with the "epics came out in Kunark" bs, then they should keep the tier in 8 and really develop them well.

I'm more concerned with the arrow mechanics as that has more impact further out.
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Old 01-28-2008, 09:09 PM  
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Default Re: State of our Class - Rangers

Awsome posting first of all!!!

Just fix me ammo and give me a way to summon better ammo then T8 crafted thats what i say.....and if they are worried so much bout T8 summoned ammo make it a loot item be it like the bows from DT but RANGER only then all the other classes still need to buy from crafters and keeping coin in their pocket aswell.....everyone would win with this I believe

Second thing I think is BS is the hit ratio of VP I mean come on missing 2-4 auto atks in a row sometimes missing both DA atks is imo retarted in the worst way........give me better ammo to get them auto atks in since it is u knwo a majority of my dps....

Also our illus and wizzy are pwnign me on parse now that they are getting geard up where im stagnent caues of hit ratio and T7 bow with no hopes of upgrade....and BTW im happy for one ouf out dirges but the last 4 recipies that dropped were ones for dirges what up with that? Is that the best SOE can do on random loots off of mobs in VP?

And last Silverwing or whatever its called is a RANGER bow give it a damn dely of 9percent so when it drops I have a reason to bid on it

Thanks for the awsome post

Stridure Ranger'Danger
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