How to calculate ca dmg vs crit

speedycerv · 07-04-2008, 04:25 PM

I've seen this thread already. http://www.eq2flames.com/rangers/159...ca-vs-dps.html
But i don't see anything relating to how to compare ca+ mod and crits just haste, dps mod, and rda.
Ca+ only adds after the dmg is rolled. crits have a chance to increase the damage of a ca and auto attack by 130%. I was assuming that crit was the way to go till u are capped, then worry about ca+. Rather than doing that, is there some way to see how much i would get out of increaseing my ca mod over crit?

Safana · 07-04-2008, 07:46 PM

Calculating the benefit of crit is difficult because we have focus aim, that increases our crit up to cap and over it, so nearly every ranged hit in that duration. In longer fights when focus aim expires or on fast moving trash fights when its down, crit is more important.
Calculating ca dmg mod is very easy. Just add how much CAs you cast per minute or per typical fight, like following example shows. In a typical 25sec trash fight i cast around 20 combat arts when everything is up.

Casted Combat Arts * CA Mod / Fight Duration

Would be the following for my example:

20 * 340 / 25 = 272 without debuffs

Safana · 07-05-2008, 09:50 AM

To determine how many DPS 1% ranged crit does you have to calculate it for your autoattack and your ranged CAs.
Following formula provides the avg crit for any weapon:

avg crit = (Max+1 / 1,3 - Min) * Max+1 + (Max+1 - Max+1 / 1,3) * (Max+1 + Max * 1,3) / 2 / (Max+1 - Min)

For mythical Eagles Talon that would be following:

Normal: 204 - 1156
Crit Range: 1157 - 1503
Average Normal Hit: 680
Average Crit Hit: 1205
Average Damage Increase: 77.27%

That means, that an avg crit does 77,27% more dmg than an avg non crit. For 1% crit that would be 1/100, so 0.77% more autoattack DPS. But autoattack is only around one half of ranger DPS.

Combat arts work the same way, crits are calculated like crits for weapons.

Combat art values (with capped 1220 STR, +390 combat art damage, full Enlivened Chance Set, and mythical Eagles Talon):

Advice: These are approximate values, since I did not take off all my +combat art damage gear and set so i did some backward calculations for the crit range because +combat art damage cannot crit.

Longstab
Normal: 1315 - 1932
Crit Range: 1933 - 2395
Average Normal Hit: 1624
Average Crit Hit: 2066
Average Damage Increase: 35.87%

Combustion Strike
Normal: 1634 - 2463
Crit Range: 2464 - 3085
Average Normal Hit: 2049
Average Crit Hit: 2643
Average Damage Increase: 35,85%

Jolting Strike
Normal: 980 - 1478
Crit Range: 1479 - 1804
Average Normal Hit: 1229
Average Crit Hit: 1561
Average Damage Increase: 39,56%

Arrow Tear
Normal: 1279 - 1872
Crit Range: 1872 - 2317
Average Normal Hit: 1576
Average Crit Hit: 2001
Average Damage Increase: 35,87%

Immobilizing Lunge
Normal: 1235 - 1799
Crit Range: 1800 - 2222
Average Normal Hit: 1517
Average Crit Hit: 1921
Average Damage Increase: 35,89%

Bloody Reminder
Normal: 560 - 673 / 413 * 10
Crit Range: 674 - 758 / 537 * 10
Average Normal Hit: 617 / 413 * 10
Average Crit Hit: 698 / 537 * 10
Average Damage Increase: 36,06%

Kunark Blade
Normal: 3175 - 5031
Crit Range: 5032 - 6423
Average Normal Hit: 4103
Average Crit Hit: 5433
Average Damage Increase: 35,83%

Sinister Strike
Normal: 2742 - 4310
Crit Range: 4311 - 5486
Average Normal Hit: 3526
Average Crit Hit: 4650
Average Damage Increase: 35,84%

Roped Shot
Normal: 879 - 1366
Crit Range: 1367 - 1659
Average Normal Hit: 1123
Average Crit Hit: 1434
Average Damage Increase: 42,58%

Searing Shot
Normal: 993 - 1395 / 603 - 1005
Crit Range: 1396 - 1697 / 1006 - 1307
Average Normal Hit: 1194 / 804
Average Crit Hit: 1483 / 1093
Average Damage Increase: 35,89%

Blame Arrow
Normal: 2739 - 4306
Crit Range: 4307 - 5481
Average Normal Hit: 3523
Average Crit Hit: 4645
Average Damage Increase: 35,84%

Vulnerable Arrow
Normal: 1919 - 2939
Crit Range: 2940 - 3704
Average Normal Hit: 2429
Average Crit Hit: 3160
Average Damage Increase: 35,85%

Amazing Arrow
Normal: 1885 - 2882
Crit Range: 2883 - 3630
Average Normal Hit: 2384
Average Crit Hit: 3098
Average Damage Increase: 35,85%

Triple Burst
Normal: 817 - 1102 / 855 - 1425 / 1283 - 2138
Crit Range: 1103 - 1316 / 1426 - 1853 / 2139 - 2779
Average Normal Hit: 960 / 1140 / 1711
Average Crit Hit: 1164 / 1549 / 2324
Average Damage Increase: 35,89%

Rear Shot
Normal: 2237 - 3469
Crit Range: 3470 - 4393
Average Normal Hit: 2853
Average Crit Hit: 3736
Average Damage Increase: 35,85%

Fittest Survival
Normal: 1855 - 3005
Crit Range: 3006 - 3868
Average Normal Hit: 2430
Average Crit Hit: 3254
Average Damage Increase: 35,84%

Stealth Fire
Normal: 4021 - 6441
Crit Range: 6442 - 8256
Average Normal Hit: 5231
Average Crit Hit: 6965
Average Damage Increase: 35,83%

Shower of Arrows
Normal: 4168 - 6627
Crit Range: 6628 - 8576
Average Normal Hit: 5398
Average Crit Hit: 7222
Average Damage Increase: 34,63%

Sniper Arrow
Normal: 9136 - 14968
Crit Range: 14969 - 19341
Average Normal Hit: 12052
Average Crit Hit: 16230
Average Damage Increase: 35,83%

So, for combat arts crits are around 36% more DPS, 1% crit would be 0,36% more DPS.
On my last parse around 51% was autoattack and 33% combat art damage (23% ranged, 10% melee).
So, adding 1% ranged crit would result in a DPS gain of 0,51 * 0,0077 + 0,23 * 0,0036 = 0,004755 = 0,4755%.

Casting order

To evaluate, what CAs are better to cast, simply divide its avg by its cast time (including 0,5sec recovery). The higher the value, the better the combat art. Taking 25% melee crit and 65% ranged crit, this would be as follows:

Longstab
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 1735
Damage/Casttime: 1993

Combustion Strike
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 2198
Damage/Casttime: 2526

Jolting Strike
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 1312
Damage/Casttime: 1508

Arrow Tear
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 1682
Damage/Casttime: 1934

Immobilizing Lunge
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 1618
Damage/Casttime: 1860

Bloody Reminder
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 5077
Damage/Casttime: 5836

Kunark Blade
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 4436
Damage/Casttime: 5098

Sinister Strike
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 3807
Damage/Casttime: 4375

Roped Shot
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 1325
Damage/Casttime: 1523

Searing Shot
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 2374
Damage/Casttime: 2728

Blame Arrow
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 4252
Damage/Casttime: 4888

Vulnerable Arrow
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 2904
Damage/Casttime: 1804

Amazing Arrow
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 2848
Damage/Casttime: 1769

Triple Burst
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 4608
Damage/Casttime: 3686

Rear Shot
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 3427
Damage/Casttime: 2742

Fittest Survival
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 2966
Damage/Casttime: 1483

Stealth Fire
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 6358
Damage/Casttime: 2338

Shower of Arrows
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 6584
Damage/Casttime: 4389

Sniper Arrow
Cast Time: 0.37
Average Hit: 14768
Damage/Casttime: 3516

With that values you can see, what CA is the best to cast, if more then one are up.

Sorted from highest to lowest value:
Bloody Reminder
Kunark Blade
Blame Arrow
Shower of Arrows
Sinister Strike
Triple Burst
Sniper Arrow
Rear Shot
Searing Shot
Combustion Strike
Stealth Fire
Longstab
Arrow Tear
Immobilizing Lunge
Vulnerable Arrow
Amazing Arrow
Roped Shot
Jolting Strike
Fittest Survival

Thats does not mean, that the CAs with lower values are worse then others and provide less DPS than others, it just means, that you always should cast the most highest CA to get the most DPS at that point. Also sometimes its better to cast other CAs like when focus aim is up.

Grats on reading until here, hope it helps, and maybe i will bring it into some nice format like Daray on the wizzard forums some day.

speedycerv · 07-07-2008, 04:13 PM

ok tell me if im doing this right.
for me this is the breakdown:
23% of my damage is from ranged cas
36% of my damage is ranged autoattack
(.36*.0077) + (.23 * .0036) = .0036 = .36% = 1% ranged crit
adding up all my dps from vp trash parse for ranged damage i get
3816 dps
thus .36% of 3816 is 13.7. 4x that is 54.8 dps to see the ranged crit increase from thuuga, and how it would help.
And my numbers for that should be higher than usual because i was using a choker during the parse.

ok now for the 50 ca dmg. Over the vp parse i had 4207 hits with cas. and it was over 73 min 21 sec.
(4207*50)/4401 = 47.8dps
so the 50 ca dmg gives me 47.8 dps (without debuffs)

47.8+54.8=102.6 dps from 4% ranged crit and 50 dps mod.
Now i'm going to figure out how much dps choker is giving me for myself. (I know u said u figure it out for yours already but i need to learn to do it too) :D

speedycerv · 07-07-2008, 04:38 PM

OK BTC dps:
Sum of all damage for btc effected damage= 15,489,119
10% of this is 1,548,911.
1,548,911/4401=351dps
4401 is the amount of seconds the parse totaled.
I did 10% of my total damage but this number is higher by a bit cuz i already had the choker on during this parse, so if someone had thuuga on that did around as much dps as me i could take 10% of that and take the average and it would be close to the actual dps increase.
Unless theres a formula i don't know about. hehe
Cuz this increases base dmg which also means the crits will be higher.

So from my tries from what you've given me safa, choker is 351dps (highballing it), thugga is 102dps.

speedycerv · 07-07-2008, 05:07 PM

Ok I was informed by a guildie that 99% of the time other peoples procs are effected by the choker, for example blade chime. So with those added in, I get 383dps for the choker, no way amulet of agony comes close to that.

Safana · 07-07-2008, 05:41 PM

To calc DPS you get from Choker:

DPS added by Choker = DPS affected by Choker / 11

Derivation:

Choker adds 10%, so you have 110% of the original DPS when wearing the Choker

110% / 10% = DPS affected by Choker / DPS added by Choker

DPS added by Choker = DPS affected by Choker * 10 / 110

P.S. Be sure you only add the CA casts when calcing the DPS Gain for +CA dmg and not every hit (Bloody Reminder, Searing Shot, Triple Burst...)