The Raven Mythic of AB - Page 12

Auroz · 11-30-2007, 02:09 PM

So wait a minute, this whole drama fight started because a girl imagined that their fake online persona wanted to worship a different god in their fake rp story?

And then IRL people got pissed at her?

Seriously don't understand RP people.

Legion · 11-30-2007, 02:26 PM

No, that's not quite how Renita's post read. Azaelia ICly changed religions. Some people ICly had serious doubts, and some ICly called her a heretic for abandoning her old faith. That was all in-character.

Azaelia, for some bizarre reason, had a problem with that IRL and started abusing her power on her message board (that, you know, was supposed to be for the community) and squelched the role-play. Which, of course, wasn't the first time she abused her power on that board, but it was the most prominent, and the one which (I think) eventually put the nail in the coffin for her board.

Role-play isn't the problem here. Its the people who can't distinguish between real life and fantasy. Most people can step back and realize that the shit is happening to their character, not them. Some can't, and frankly I'm overjoyed when they get mad and walk away from the rest of us. We don't need that crap.

Exeter · 11-30-2007, 02:29 PM

I have no idea what this is all about. I am convinced, though, that the OP has some serious anger issues that likely need to be worked out with a combination of good psychiatry, good meds and a some good alone time with some porn a box of Kleenex.

crazy + blue-balls = terrible R-a-R post

Duvessa · 11-30-2007, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auroz

So wait a minute, this whole drama fight started because a girl imagined that their fake online persona wanted to worship a different god in their fake rp story?

And then IRL people got pissed at her?

Seriously don't understand RP people.

No, it really didn't, though that's the story that would at least make some kind of twisted sense.

RP, cybering, the Raven... they really have nothing at all to do with any of this.

What it comes down to is that Leithe is... well, Leithe. His attitude rubs a lot of people the wrong way. Burns bridges, etc.

Leithe had a in-game mate and RL friend named Azaelia. They were tight, and Azaelia stuck by Leithe loyally. To a fault some might say. No matter what Leithe did, Azaelia supported him unconditionally. That kind of loyalty is hard to come by, but it also makes problems.

As a leader of her guild, it caused friction between her and guildmates who had trouble with Leithe. Lots of fighting, bickering, people leaving the guild, and so on.

Eventually, Leithe and Azaelia left the guild she created, to focus less on RP, more on raiding. The friction between those parties continued. Azaelia tried to set up RP in Qeynos that brought on a lot of in-character conflict, as you might expect when one of the great Norrathian evils suddenly turns good. Azaelia didn't want any of that, and asked for it to stop. That caused more conflict.

And I stop here to note that none of this involved me.

Eventually, disgusted with the community she was once a major force in, Azaelia closed down her RP web site, and off she went to do other things. More drama.

Leithe posted on my web site, on the AB boards, anyplace else he felt like it, his feelings about the community. Feelings, much as I can tell, shared by Azaelia, though expressed by her with a little bit more tact.

Now, my forums have specific rules. No bashing other players, EQ, SOE, yadda. I just didn't want that shit on my site, as there were plenty of other places for it.

Leithe insisted on posting it there, he well knew the rules against it, but kept doing so. Finally, I just banned him.

So, then he posts here, points back to the RM, and tells you all to have at it. Pointing out the fact that one forum out of 20 has mature content on it, having his friend post that elegant rant, etc. It's all just misdirection, inviting you to come jump on the bandwagon.

Though, the RM wasn't his guild, most of the people there didn't know him, or his backstory, and only a few former guildmates that also happened to post there were involved in much of anything. I can think of a few people he specifically didn't like, but none of it had anything to do with RP, cybering, or his participation on the Raven in the game.

I've tried hard to keep some respect for Leithe, and to treat what he says fairly, but... I can't help coming back to the simplest explanation, that this is just retaliation, plain and simple.

Leithe says he respects me, but I just don't get how you can respect someone, and constantly break the rules of a thing they run. Or how that respect equates pointing to my site, and setting it up for mockery.

Gods knows, roleplayers on more than one ocassion have deserved to be mocked, but... that's not what this is about for Leithe. It's what he wants it to be about for you, but for him... this all goes back to a guild I wasn't in, a fight I wasn't a part of, and the fact he couldn't obey a few forum rules.

Kartikeya · 11-30-2007, 05:11 PM

I'd clarify a bit more, but Duvessa pretty much nailed it all exactly. So I'll just point to the above post and nod.

Duvessa · 11-30-2007, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legion

Role-play isn't the problem here. Its the people who can't distinguish between real life and fantasy. Most people can step back and realize that the shit is happening to their character, not them. Some can't, and frankly I'm overjoyed when they get mad and walk away from the rest of us. We don't need that crap.

In any evil-to-good story, there's a part where the repentant person has to face up to the past, and make amends, before being welcomed into the good side. Azaelia basically wanted to skip that part. I think it would be wrong to say she was having problems separating fantasy and reality, she just wanted to skip the really craptacular part of the redemption story where everyone hates you.

I can see why she would not want to RP that part of the story. I don't agree with skipping it, but it is the part that sucks, and when you're trying to RP less, not more, you don't want to deal with extra plots.

Azaelia did delete one, maybe more, posts related to people's reaction to her story, and ask in other places that the aforementioned craptacular part be skipped. This generated more drama, because of other conflicts. Some people were already mad for other OOC things, and this just give everyone something new to keep being upset about.

And, of course, gave everyone a chance to royally screw up again. There's few places in this drama I have observed where I don't hold everyone responsible for screwing something up.

In this case, it really wasn't roleplaying that lead to OOC hurt feelings and accusations, rather, it was all the OOC crap that ruined RP for many involved on all sides.

I'm not defending everything Azaelia ever did, but I will stand up and say when I think there's something she clearly did not do. Azaelia was many things, but she was not some dork obsessed with her characater's RP so much that fantasy and reality blended.

Leithe · 11-30-2007, 07:32 PM

I was gonna ignore the replies but there's too much fucking bullshit here. I'm just gonna correct people on what happened.

In regards to one of the earlier bans: Vakarina.

You fucking pussies. There was an unorganized "guild leader vote" on this one. 90% of the people wanted her banned. 10% didn't. Where the fuck are you now? You're embracing her and hugging her like a bunch of neutral, fence-setting faggots. Where the fuck went your vehemence? The "Omg I steer clear of all her shit she's a total drama whore"? That's what I want to know.

Though from what I hear, there are people bitching about her being in the GL forums on the new RP community. Have fun with that. Hopefully people won't be pussies, but the community has an affinity for having no testicles and instead wanting to be a prostitute's undiscriminating fuckhole. AKA, fence setting neutral pussies.

Posts weren't deleted save for rants and flames and general drama inciting posts directed at the admin or others.

Here's what happened with the other bans. Not gonna name names because I don't give a fuck. Anyone who needs to know who they are knows who they are and I don't feel the need to call them out.

I take it back, I'll call one out because he's the fucking douchebag that started it.

Douchebag_001 Also known as Arnyric also known as "I'mgonnashovemydickupyourasswhetheryoulikeitornot " posted something drama-inciting, anonymously. I saw this, and erring on the cautious side, pulled the thread to admin discussion while I took the time to figure out if everyone involved in said post was comfortable with this guy fucking over what they were trying to do through roleplay. Roleplay isn't an excuse to be a cockmangling fuckbucket.

Ok, so after I do this, I post that I moved it to admin. I no longer have the original post, nor would I bother digging it up, but basically I worded it carefully, and also stated that it might be temporary, and that it was pulled because I was unclear whether or not the people involved were uncomfortable with it. I dunno about you guys, but I personally don't support unwelcomed sodomy, except in PVP.

On my new thread, a couple of people decided to be asshats and bitch about how they disagreed with my actions, despite it being temporary just so I could gauge the comfort zones of those it involved. Had they said nothing? The post would have been restored. Such has already been made clear to me. Sadly, that was not the case. Drama on the thread, IE no thread for you.

Now, because I questioned comfort zones, I did what I thought was NICE for the people involved and went over to seperate boards and asked that it be temporarily ignored while it's figured out whether or not people want to be fucked in the ass continuously after it had already dragged on for months and was finally (supposedly) gonna be brought to a close.

Which brings me to the side-rant. The "there was no transition!" Fuck you. Yes there was. For months. But nobody would move the fuck on. Kinda like how I won't move the fuck on now? Ring any bells? Starting to see why I have trouble shutting the fuck up? You fucking hypocrites.

Back on topic. After the one thread was locked, a thread was made in GL asking why it happened. It was answered. The poster argued. Thread locked, as the decision was made.

Then the poster made another thread. Continuing the argument. So the poster was banned.

Then another poster, of close relation to the aforementioned poster, made two more (IIRC) threads, continuing the argument further, and was consequently banned.

Then a third poster, also of close relation to the two aforementioned poster, posted in a public forum, asking for clarification on policy. I'll be honest. I thought this was heavy-handed at first, because the only part of the post that was really fuckin' irritating was the title.

...That ban, I honestly think, would have been reversed. But then, the poster of that particular thread, went to two other boards and posted the same shit.

So the ban stuck and I wholeheartedly supported that shit.

So that's what happened with that. Don't by this "THEY BANNED PEOPLE FOR ASKING WHY" faggotry. That's not what happened.

Also, Legion, go play in the sandbox unless you're gonna stop being an anonymous, uninformed, ignorant, retarded fuck.

Leithe · 11-30-2007, 07:54 PM

Oh, I tried to add it in but took an AFK so I timed out and couldn't edit (15 min limit)

Anyway. What I didn't mention about one of the banned posters is that they continuously tried to return on alts, like 5000 times, and tried every single little tiny detail they could to circumvent the ban.

ANd yeah. Yeah they were ex-guildies. But they were ex-guildies with a vendetta (at that time), apparently. Mistakes were made on both sides but I don't like it when one side's made to look guilty and one is fucking spotless.

I really don't hold any ill will toward them anymore. I've made amends (imo) to the point where I can converse politely, and one of them actually sent me a tell, unprompted, agreeing that Gnobrin's decision on the SOE boards to ban me permanently for mocking someone who was basically, for lack of a better word, being racist.

Kartikeya · 11-30-2007, 08:51 PM

*laughs* You are so full of shit. Here, lemme jog your memory. Here's how you responded to me when I expressed my concern:

The only reason I removed the post that was there is because no (or at least, not all) parties involved were asked if it was ok/inside their comfort zone. The post in question happened to be way out of the comfort zone and not the type of RP conflict desired. The RP with Az converting was meant to be a somewhat small-scale thing with just a few public conflicts about it, not something where someone tries to jump in and turn as many people as possible against her. THat's all - just outside the comfort zone.

And here's how you responded on the VK forum version of the thread:

/ooc

Heads up!

Hey guys! We're asking that this be ignored, at least temporarily. Whoever posted this did not ask permission and as it stands right now, we don't really want RP from this particular post to continue, because it's not in the comfort/fun zone of all parties involved ATM. Azaelia should be in contact tomorrow, either via posting here or contacting responding posters or guild leaders wherever this's been posted. So far I've only seen this here and on the EQ2 RPer site where I have suspended the post until further notice.

I'd post the 'offending' post, but the guy deleted it ages ago. For you EQ2flamer folks, lemme just summarize. It went like this:

Oh noz, Azaelia, former Innoruuk baby eater, is in Qeynos claiming she's on the good side! She's obviously lying. Let's make sure our city is safe.

That, THAT was what caused all this crazy. Real douchebag drama stirrer there. Give me a fucking break. You ran a PUBLIC event. Open to the PUBLIC. Advertised on MULTIPLE sites. And you made this event the big ta da revealing of Az's new leaf. He responded ICly, giving YOUR event attention...

And you banned him. Then you ran around to the other sites he made that post on, and called him a godmoder and asked people to ignore his RP because, AMG, no one had ASKED you if they could response to your big public event. (There were how many people there? Easily 20, and anyone was invited to come.)

The fact that you're still trying to act like you're the victims in all this is both hilarious and really, really sad.

Timeline of events for the non-AB crowd:

-Az creates community site.

-Az at some point makes Leithe a mod (why Az, why?)

-Az decides to RP turning over a new leaf, something which I had fun interacting with. She doesn't want it to be a big thing, folks respect this.

-Az then turns around and MAKES it a big thing herself, by running a well advertised public event in which her 'revelation' is the great big twist.

-People respond in predictable ways, all IC.

-Some guy makes an IC post, which was just like dozens that I made, and others made, in response to public events. The difference was, it was THEIR event, and their panties were in a wad.

-In a move that shocks no one, Leithe does something incredibly stupid and doesn't consult with Az first so that she can tell him it's a bad idea. This is routine for him. Just this time he did it as a site moderator.

-People react poorly to a really stupid decision

-Some of those people are members of their old guild. BAN BAN BAN.

-Mod 'rules' are posted. The rules are basically: Leithe can do what he wants.

-Lots and lots and LOTS of people try to talk Az down, and explain why this is a bad thing.

-Az ignores all of them.

-Some people follow through on their concerns and leave the site.

-Most people (like me) decide that they enjoy the site too much to quit in protest, and hang around.

-About a month later: The site is closed and the forums locked without any warning or explanation.

-People on RM wonder at why this happened, and a lot of people wish Az and Leithe the best and thank them for running a well loved site for the RP community for over two years.

-Leithe shows up on the RM thread and calls everyone a bunch of poo poo heads and wags his finger, because it's totally everyone's fault this decision was made. Oh, and by the way, if anyone wants their old posts they should PM Leithe or Az to get them back.

-People respond poorly to being blamed for someone else's temper tantrum.

-Some people make new icons to represent their new poo poo head status.

-Leithe continues to prance around and scream on the RM thread.

-All sympathy for Az: vanishes.

-A thread on the official AB forums springs up for the same reason as the RM thread: wondering what happened. Leithe calls people poo poo heads some more.

-Az shows up on the official thread to say 'I'm taking my ball and going home, screw all y'all and this popsicle stand'.

-People don't respond well to being given the virtual middle finger.

-Spindel expresses his disappointment. Spindel doesn't get his threads back because of it, nah nah boo boo.

-Official thread is locked.

-RM thread is locked.

-The AB RP community mills about for a few days, decides to go make a new site for everyone.

-Site is made, up, and ready very quickly.

-People flock to the new site.

-Known RP guilds get invitations to the new site. All of them. This includes Leithe and Az's new guild.

-Apparently extending an olive branch is 'tacky' and unwelcome.

-The new admin say 'whatever'.

-Things go fine.

-Leithe declares himself a l33t anti-RPer now, and runs around existing in order to, so he claims, spite people.

-No one cares.

-Duvessa has more patience than God, but finally bans him because he doesn't know the meaning of the words 'follow the rules'.

-Leithe gets his friend to write a really weak flame on RM.

-Shockingly, this flame is also removed.

-Leithe makes this post because the meanie RM people removed his friend's l33t flame.

-A lot of people apparently learn for the first time that guys sometimes play chicks in video games.

-Everyone else wonders what rock these people have been living under for the past decade.

Leithe · 11-30-2007, 09:04 PM

No,it wasn't the big "Ta-Da New Az" eve, you fucking idiot, which pretty much invalidates your entire post. Though I didn't honestly bother to read it beyond the beginning and noticing a few things that stuck out, because I didn't do that with your past ones anyway.

It was VK who decided to turn it into a big fucking deal. Maybe not the guild as a whole, but the people who made the decisions, anyway. It was otherwise going to be a side thing that was irrelevent to the conversion of the leader.