EQAditu

Heh, we're getting killed by caps now, aren't we?

I got Overconfidence right before Christmas break and I tried it once before long ago... it's hard to say if it even works let alone if it is worth it. It's not as though there's a message saying that you did a good job in casting it. Usually you're going to throw Soothe or Overconfidence on when aggro is shakey. But aggro is already uncertain, so how do you know that the spells did their job and the tank didn't do it... or the DPS didn't deaggro? You more or less have to hope you didn't waste your time and never know for sure.

Just as a side note, in case you didn't know. Soothe when cast, makes the mob cast an AE deaggro on the group of its current target. So it's not a single target deaggro nor a raid wide deaggro. Meaning, if it is on the MT, you're only deaggroing the non-fighters in that group. So in most cases its only really useful when someone strips. On the plus side, if you have spell effects on, when you cast it, all 6 people shimmer green and yawn. It's amusing to me at least.

And as a side, side note... Overconfidence makes the mob yawn when you cast it on them. Go do it before you pull a humanoid raid mob for a chuckle. If you're lucky, some other people will see it too.

Istaril

Aye - Soothe is essentially useless in MT group because the only people in it are healers (who don't over-aggro) and transfers (who don't over-aggro). I didn't even bother getting it. As mentioned previously, it's useful only in group settings - handy on drusilla sathir, for example.

As for overconfidence - it DOES work as intended. Friend (Mage) hits mob a few times, I heal him, I deaggro (ensuring mob is on him), I cast overconfidence, mob hits him, mob turns to me. Looks good. Same test with three people - also good. It does drop the target's hate by 2 positions.

The catch is a) it has to hit that target (and not kill it, obviously), b) it's only up half the time, c) I'm not quite sure how it'll work on some (non-targetted) ae's and the like.


Caps:
Mark: Don't worry. Base = 20%, 5 AA - 30%, Blessings and LOTD = Still shy of 40% cap.
Involuntary: Base = 3.9/min, max=7.9 (.85?)/min. 3AA+Blessings+LOTD is less than cap (3.7), 4aa is beyond cap (3.9), 5 is a damned waste.
Glory: Base = 1.0/min, max = 2.0/min. 1AA+Blessings+LOTD=1.8/min. 2AA+Blessings+LOTD=over cap. 3 is a damned waste.
Unyielding: Don't worry, you won't cap it in regular groups.

EQAditu

Oh, I know that they both work from a technical stand point... but how can you tell that they worked while in a raid? That aggro switched? That's not a very reliable indicator.

I don't recall if Overconfidence's wording in the effects list means that any damage done will proc or just melee strikes. I thought it got used up instantly on AEs, but it may have been my imagination. I think I did those tests back when it would expend a trigger on a fighter class but not deaggro. It certainly doesn't now... you can test that with your pet hammer (it's a fighter class). Overconfidence will not trigger on it.

Istaril

Well since it DOES work from a technical standpoint, I have to assume it works on raids. If it triggers as aggro switches (a few times), then it's a fairly reliable indicator.

Considering the worthlessness of Cures/Compliances, I'm not expecnting Overconfidence to be very useful. But if it saves someone once or twice a VP clear - say, by tossing it on Xygoz's notes, it's still better than cures.

And the phrasing is "on any attack" (which includes spell attacks) - but since it will only trigger if the TARGET is not fighter, it should still be ok for most AEs... in theory.

EQAditu

All I'm saying is that I wish there was a more definite indicator. When someone strips, you can expect the tank to get it back anyhow. The time that takes is variable and sometimes can be very quick. If you cast Overconfidence, is it a trigger that puts it back on the tank, or what would have happened regardless? There's of course no harm in casting it and assuming, but you won't be right 100% of the time with that assumption.

Momolicious

Overconfidence:

The problem is with this spell it will trigger off ANY attack the targets mob causes. This includes dots ticking, non-CA debuffs, etc. This makes it extreamly unreliable in some situations, almost to the point of uselessness.

Mob is on Captain Overnuke, you hit OC, and the mob still has a dot ticking on the group 4 troub... troub triggers it and recieves the effect.

Enhanced Soothe:

I constantly cast this. As it is an immediate -1230 hate to all non fighters in the mobs currently targeted group it certainly helps. There is zero reason to not cast this. I am not sure what the Coercer was complaining about. It is a static -1230 not a passeive debuff to agro gain (something coercers have in the STA line) so it should have zero effect even on the hate trans classes. Hate is transfered at the point of generation not as a constant, else trans classes could never deagro as they would deagro the tank to, which does not happen.)

Caps:

Retarded

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Tombstone high with Graveyard eyes.
2 foot 2 and I dun mind dieing.

"Good players can make themselves useful, but huge efforts should not be made to attain levels of use that others can accomplish with far less effort because their class was designed more intelligently." --

Ancient Rites

Istaril

So... been playing around with the dodge hammer from Chelsith....

Here are some results:

Elder Ekron: I dodged 2.53% of Swings
Tank dodged 1.69% of swings

Druushk: I dodged 1.33% of Swings
Tank dodged 2.65% of Swings

That's of 582 swings/cas, so not much of a sample size, but a start.

Really looking forward to using the hammer on Silverwing.

As for overconfidence, it actually DID save a clothy today. It was amazing. Almost certain it was overconfidence.. the clothy was hit, somehow survived, and the mob went straight back to MT as OC procc'd. Could have been... recapture from guard number 2, taunts... but... it *could* have been Overconfidence. The 25 m range means I can't use it as a pacify for social aggro worth half a damn in VP (which might actually be useful). Was too busy most of the time to actually check it's effects with most targetted/encounter/point-blank aes, but I'll get some more testing done.

PS : The Tangrin is HARD. Ugh.

RedHawk

LOTD seems to give Mark 4% but Involuntary 6% (with 5aa's in each and no blessings up).

Blessings seems to give Mark 4% but Involuntary 6% (with 5aa's in each and no LOTD up).

So Blessings = LOTD as far as actual effect goes, assuming no display bug.

So do they actually both work that way for both Mark and Involuntary? Or is one display bugged, and if so, which?

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Fungie

The description is a bit tricky... someone explained it to me once, but I'm not 100% sure I'm remembering it correctly.

"any successful attack" = melee, ranged, spell
"a successful attack" = an attack with that particular weapon

IOW, you have to actually be swinging the hammer. I don't think spells will do the trick.

Aesculapius

Thought I'd post my 2cp worth... I'm running as follows:
STR: 4-6-4-8-1
AGI: 4-4-8-8-1
STA: 4-4-4-7

I was in love with the INT line back in EoF but not with the many new spells, raid-wide buffs, additional AAs, etc... I just don't see the need to carry it anymore if I can gain any advantage with Steadfast and Holy Shield.

We are just now starting on T2 RoK so maybe something in there will change my mind but thus far, we've cleared T1 in less than a month only raiding 3 days/ week so why worry about additional casting speed with all the new toys peeps are using in raids now.

I'd wouldn't mind some value input if you think that those of us that are not NPU, CL, AM, etc... are going about these aa lines in a manner that will not allow us MT Temps to be as effective as possible.

For reference, I am using Guard of Drelikus with adorn and both wrists adorned for the + block & parry %. If Chelsith would actually DROP some f-ing gear, I'd use the Guardian 1H and the plate forearm too, but that's a tale for another day.

Peace

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Aesculapius - 80 Templar/ 80 Sage, Iron Fortress