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Old 04-11-2008, 05:50 PM  
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Icon3 Warden vs. Templar (help please)

Let me just start by saying how thankful I am for being directed to these forums. Ive had so many questions anwered in under 5 minutes of browsing, than I have had in the past 3 weeks of playing EQ2.

I defected from WoW to EQ2 3 weeks ago, and through the suggestion of some friends that have been playing EQ2 since release they suggested I make a fury. As my fury is progressing in levels (she is 57 now) I find their role in higher levels, and end-game raiding to be slightly dull. I have a warden alt, which lately I much rather enjoy playing. I have always been a main healer (was a priest in WoW for 4 years) and because I played a priest, the Templar class has also been suggested to me. and I guess the questions Im asking are:
  • What is the main role of a Warden when grouped with other healers in end-game raids?
  • What is the main role of a Templar and what is the playstyle like in comparison to the warden?
  • What do you feel to be more in-demand?
  • For those of you who played WoW or still do and know the priest class, which do you think would be similar to it play-style wise?
  • A pro vs con sheet would be helpful for those so inclined to do so.
I thank you all for any and all feedback.
-Chant
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Old 04-11-2008, 06:28 PM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

  • What is the main role of a Warden when grouped with other healers in end-game raids?
A Warden is THE support healer when grouped with other healers in end-game raids. We spend a lot of time spot healing out of group to keep the raid topped off as well as reacting to massive damage spikes on the MT that the slower casting defiler and templar may not be able to react quickly enough for. If you want to be the 'main healer' roll a defiler. The Warden is used in the Main Tank group as the optimal druid healer, but the downside to this is that the druid heals are only needed on the hardest of encounters and when you are learning and breaking content. Because of this a lot of Wardens in the top end game raiding guilds sit quite frequently (me included). The warden is the healer you need in the main tank group when shit really hits the fan or when there is massive amounts of AOE damage. Other than the incredibly fast spam like heals we bring to the group we offer relatively little. Our buffs are all subpar which is why when the extra priest isnt needed they will ALWAYS choose Defiler / Templar combo and replace the third healer with an extra hate transfer (assassin or swashbuckler).
  • What is the main role of a Templar and what is the playstyle like in comparison to the warden?
The Templar class has by far the best tank buffs of any of the priest classes. They are by far the single best class to have for a tank IMO. They have stoneskin, tons of hitpoint buffs, they have critical temporary spells such as Sanctuary (immunity to control effects) and Shield of Faith (temporary ward vs arcane damage and seeing as how most all mobs do arcane their ward is WAY more effective than the Warden equivalent elemental ward). The templars typically have the 'big heals' but the cast on them is much slower than a druid. The templar is a cleric class and most of their heals come from reactive heals. Reactive heals are duration spells that have charges on them and when the tank takes damage a charge is used and heals for a minor amount. Reactives wont ever really stop your tank from dying, though it will make him die a lot slower. Templars also get arguably the BEST level 80 spell in the game. With repent Templars get a ward and can actually compete somewhat against a shaman on the parse.
  • What do you feel to be more in-demand?
Templar by far for the reasons I mentioned in my answer to your first question. Wardens are good to have around for breaking and learning content and for massive AOE damage encounters and encounters with a lot of elemental damage (very rare this expansion), but wardens are by FAR the most expendable of all the healer classes.
  • For those of you who played WoW or still do and know the priest class, which do you think would be similar to it play-style wise?
Never played WoW. I cant answer this questions.
  • A pro vs con sheet would be helpful for those so inclined to do so.
Warden

Pros
- Lots of Death Intervention spells and emergency saves
- Incredibly fast heals all of which have HoT components
- AMAZING power / mana management with our epic weapon

Cons
- Buffs are shit
- Not truly 'needed' for any content
- No debuffs worth mentioning
- Will sit frequently in the top end game guilds
- Lower personal DPS in comparison to other priest types who spec their AAs properly (probably the second lowest overall dps for priests next to the defiler)
- Most expendable priest class for raiding. If you are going to sit a healer it will always be the warden first (player ability aside).


Templar

Pros
- Buffs more HP than any other priest type
- Have buffs that actually mean something (stoneskin, shield ally if you are spec that way)
- Have critical and NECESSARY temporary spells (mainly referring to Sanctuary)
- Has a more diverse AA selection with useful abilities such as shield ally and immunity to stun / interrupt (end line STR)
- Have repent and BIG direct heals
- Wear PLATE which means they have a MUCH MUCH wider selection of gear to choose from. Druids are restricted to leather while a templar can wear any armor type if it has good effects / stats
- Clerics are usually in high demand in any raid guild as for some reason there seem to be much fewer clerics than druids. Druids are a dime a dozen, especially furies.
- A couple of debuffs that are useful for the raid

Cons
- Casting times are longer
- Do templars really have any other cons?







So from this reply it looks like the way to go would be templar based upon what you are looking for but both classes have their high points. I personally prefer the druid classes as they are more a reactionary type of class. I generally feel I have to be more on my toes and more alert when playing a druid. I mean as a druid you cant really heal if there are no hit points missing to heal, so you have to wait and react. For clerics and shamans sure there is the snap react but its much easier to play a set it and forget it playstyle. Templars can just stack their reactives and / or repent on the tank and then recast them when they drop off. They are not reacting to damage taken they are more preparing for damage incoming. Shamans work in much the same way with wards. This not to say shamans and clerics dont have to 'react' to spike damage. They do have direct heals also for that, but they spend far less time reacting than a druid as all a druid can do is maybe precast a HoT hoping damage occurs while its ticking, but even then its still more efficient with the way + heals work to wait for the damage and cast.

I say try at least one of each of the major healer archetypes to see which one fits you best. Shamans, clerics, and druids all have differing play styles and which one fits you best is probably which one is closest to whatever type you played in WoW.
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Old 04-11-2008, 07:13 PM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

  • For those of you who played WoW or still do and know the priest class, which do you think would be similar to it play-style wise?
I've played both games on and off since betas. i never played a wow priest, but wardens are like healadins even more so with the addition of our epic
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Old 04-12-2008, 06:26 AM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

I love my warden, but I'd suggest you go with any of the other healers for what WC-Larry said, I do often get to attend raids, but then again our mt loves to have instinct :P
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Old 04-12-2008, 07:22 PM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

Larry is mostely right about everything.. although i disagree about the dps.. we are not second lowest on dps.. imo we are somewhere in the middle between mystics that can pull same dps or higher to temps that can pull same or lower.

Imo it's like that for dps healers:

1: fury
2: inq
3-4: mystic\warden
5: templar
6: defiler
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Old 04-12-2008, 07:57 PM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

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Originally Posted by Aerofae View Post
Larry is mostely right about everything.. although i disagree about the dps.. we are not second lowest on dps.. imo we are somewhere in the middle between mystics that can pull same dps or higher to temps that can pull same or lower.

Imo it's like that for dps healers:

1: fury
2: inq
3-4: mystic\warden
5: templar
6: defiler

I have to disagree as Templars can achieve 100% melee crit, 52% double attack, 20 haste, 20 dps, standing without any other mods if they spec their AAs properly. They can also take int line for spell crit and casting speed and have AAs in their templar tree for their nukes. A hybrid spec templar in a mage group would outparse a melee spec warden in a melee group.

You just havent raided with the right templars.

Mystics also get 100% crit and a more double attack than us in their shaman tree plus all their spells into CAs just like us.

I still hold firm. Were just above defilers. Any of the other priests spec properly will beat us.
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Old 04-13-2008, 06:54 AM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

Quote:
Originally Posted by WC-Larry View Post
I have to disagree as Templars can achieve 100% melee crit, 52% double attack, 20 haste, 20 dps, standing without any other mods if they spec their AAs properly. They can also take int line for spell crit and casting speed and have AAs in their templar tree for their nukes. A hybrid spec templar in a mage group would outparse a melee spec warden in a melee group.

You just havent raided with the right templars.

Mystics also get 100% crit and a more double attack than us in their shaman tree plus all their spells into CAs just like us.

I still hold firm. Were just above defilers. Any of the other priests spec properly will beat us.
If you have templar that go full dps on raid then you shouldn't let him go in raid at the first place, they are not furies after all
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Old 04-13-2008, 08:52 AM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

Having 2 templars on our roster, and having them use the AA mirror for dps specs on easy zones I can say that Larry is right, Templars, Mystics, Furies and Inq will all out dps us.
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Old 04-13-2008, 11:55 AM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

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Originally Posted by Eminaria View Post
Having 2 templars on our roster, and having them use the AA mirror for dps specs on easy zones I can say that Larry is right, Templars, Mystics, Furies and Inq will all out dps us.
Dunno i always run with 1 temp and he's always on MT so he can't really dps alot.. but i can say so far only other healer class outparsing me in my current and previous guilds was fury and mystic occasionally but never templar (my highest dps on melee spec is around 2.2k and on spellcasting spec around 1.7k).

Still temp with 100% melee crit but no CA still won't do alot.. it's the spells that got bigger dmg output.
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Old 04-13-2008, 01:54 PM  
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Default Re: Warden vs. Templar (help please)

Wardens are the lowest DPS priest in everyones optimal setup.
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