The NGD vs. Non-NGD thread

[Darammer]

Oh btw Elanie, RadarX didn't respond in your thread for one very important reason: he can't post in the Veteran's Lounge.

Some asshole actually went to the trouble of copying and hosting the thread himself so Radar could read it. What a loser...

[RadarX]

Originally Posted by Darammer

Oh btw Elanie, RadarX didn't respond in your thread for one very important reason: he can't post in the Veteran's Lounge.

Some asshole actually went to the trouble of copying and hosting the thread himself so Radar could read it. What a loser...

Yeah thats true, I can't go in there because of fan site status. I wouldn't have even known about it except for said asshole who linked it

[Pronoia]

Originally Posted by Nurta

My turn to stir



Bah! I had this nice long and scathing reply but b/c of work and meetings and me being a doofus I lost it So instead the shorter version.

I'm an ass, I like drama, I will stir the pot every chance I get. I do it on message boards b/c it allows me to be someone I can't be in RL. It's fun, I enjoy it, and I love to laugh at people who take it too seriously.
Wow, I'm impressed

I love this forum already! It's like a giant circle jerk full of angry little kids whinning about how they can't be the "cool" kid or had their lunch money taken! Well I don't have a dick but I love to watch (can we get some more male on male action too pls? that's hot) so I'm hoping for lots of excitement from you boys and girls now don't let me down! You shouldn't keep this place a secret really, invite more people. An orgy of whinners jerking would really make my days at work fly by!
And you have joined that circle Jerk of whiners with this post - grats on crossing to the dark side

Oh and btw, who are you all? You posted in NGD got laughed at and became bitter? I bet 90% of NGD doesn't even remember your petty-insignificant posts. I know I don't, b/c NGD is entertainment.
99% of all quoted statistics are false. 100% of the time. I must have told people like, a million times
It's fun, it's not serious
It's only fun and not serious because a core of posters insist on derailing and lambasting many serious attempts at a post by non regulars[/color]
I don't remember what happens in there from day to day nor do I care. And if anyone does well, I guess then you're ones whom this reply is directed at We'll have lots of fun together!You will probably find many of the posters here don't even visit the NGD forums - I know I don't but that brand of 'Humour' doesn't entertain me - but that's just me

Radar if you wear a hat like that for me I promise next time I'll use more lube hunny. God that's sexy.

Can I watch?

Oh now for some sharing time, let's hear it I want to be a circle jerker too! "Heil Anarchy!"

Trust me, you already qualify

Finally Nurta, fwiw, the few times I did attempt to wade through the garbage on the NGD forums, I found your posts to be, well, OK (patronising much?).

But fuck it eh, I'm not an NGD regular, have no wish to be, therefore you certainly don't need my approval to be who you are.

In closing, I'll raise you a fuck off bitch. Sorry I have to go out soon and can't be fagged to be any more inventive - please feel free to practice on me.

[LFG]

Originally Posted by Nurta

Oh and btw, who are you all? You posted in NGD got laughed at and became bitter? I bet 90% of NGD doesn't even remember your petty-insignificant posts.

And that is because in every case, those posts ended up being deleted.

There were cases where we were told we could not discuss certain issues in our server forums or elsewhere based on EQ2 forum rules, and that the only place we could talk about those things was NGD.

And then when we would go to NGD to talk about those things, the NGD retard possee would prevent us from doing that. I once spent a half hour typing a response to an issue in NGD, only to see it buried under 3 pages of "lol" and "hi, I like pie", and similar stupid kindergarten babble in under five minutes.

It was the ultimate Catch 22. We were told we could only post things in NGD, yet the NGD retard roundup prevented us from talking about those things there. And for the longest time, they were allowed to do that unchecked because different rules applied to that forum, or the regulars of that forum were mods who were part of the same crew of NGD regulars. Truly, SoE had made NGD posters the L337 of the EQ2 forums.

I'm sorry if you think having less rights than someone else makes us whiners.

I actually have no problem with you personally and think these discussions are healthy as hell, we weren't allowed to have them before.

[Darammer]

Most of these folks who couldn't break in to the NGD came in with piss-poor attitudes to start. Many newb posters could come in and start a serious thread there without it getting derailed, if they showed a modicum of common sense; i.e. don't flame the regulars while doing it. That's just moronic.

In the past several months, it has indeed gone downhill, but I don't think it has to do with the mods. I would wager the biggest fucktards in there now have no idea who the mods are; and the mods don't particularly like said fucktards. Hard as it is to believe, not everybody in the NGD like each other.

It went downhill starting with two posts, imo: "Class survivor" and "Whoever gets the 10000th post wins." I don't know why, but those two game threads brought a HUGE influx of idiots to the NGD, many of whom stuck around after they were done. At the same time, a lot of old-time NGDers, many of whom were some of the most intelligent, witty individuals I've ever come across, stopped posting, generally for reasons unrelated to ngd. The collective IQ took a nose-dive, and now I, too, don't feel the need to post there much.

'Course, I don't have the vitriol that some of y'all have; getting as upset as you seem to be over a message board, especially a forum like NGD, boggles the mind.

[Nurta]

Originally Posted by Pronoia

Trust me, you already qualify

Finally Nurta, fwiw, the few times I did attempt to wade through the garbage on the NGD forums, I found your posts to be, well, OK (patronising much?).

But fuck it eh, I'm not an NGD regular, have no wish to be, therefore you certainly don't need my approval to be who you are.

In closing, I'll raise you a fuck off bitch. Sorry I have to go out soon and can't be fagged to be any more inventive - please feel free to practice on me.

Hell yes! I'm a bonafide member of the circle jerk now. Pics pls Pro! email them to illmakeyouastarbigboy@lmao.com

I like you! But, no you can't watch you must join in I'm gentle at first I promise I do have a question though, what does fwiw mean? I'm not as up on the cool kid's net lingo as I probably should be :p Me patronising?!? LOL I do believe that's the first I've been called that, if you're judging me based on my posts to or about Amana then I guess I could see that. My posting intent in NGD is to just have fun. I used to post in other forums back when the game first started but to me it was too hostile I don't envy anyone who tries to moderate any post or forum on any board b/c I know how I am.

I like the Dark side, even though I play a paladin I secretly obsess about shooting pigeons and eating cake instead of pie. Besides the dark side has cookies and well a good cookie is enough to move a mountain. I enjoy the sheer silliness of not having to make sense of everythig I post or say just as much as I love to stir people up and make flip a biscuit on a forum. Mostly though I think about lesbian sex.

I can't speak for what other posters do. I don't remember (not saying it's not true) but I don't remember people being told to bring their server discussions to NGD. What I do remember is what Radar mentioned that NGD was the shit hole of the forums for a long time. Are there people in NGD who are dumbshits and derail threads b/c they think they can? No doubt, but oddly enough I don't see any of the ones whom I think are the jerks of NGD actually posting on this forum. I think they should be though!

I don't think having less rights = whining. I think dumping on a group of people and having your own sandbox where you basically make up rules to say you can say whatever you want b/c you can't say it in the official sandbox but when the crowd you don't want comes to town you flip your biscuits and tell them to leave is whining. I think you should be able to say hey (a) in EQ2 sucks! (b) in EQ2 is broken OMG fix this shit already! Hell yes that should be allowed, but when you're in someone else's sandbox you play by their rules (hence why this place was born right?) so as I tell my teenager everything is a choice; choose wrong deal with the consequence; choose wisely reap the reward.

37% of what I have stated here is bullshit! 49.3223331% of what is posted here are Nurta's deep dark feelings and fantasies about having hawt sex. .00001% of what is posted here equals the sum of pi to the 100th place times 2 and half minus 42. Which is also the size of Gaige's pecker.


Now if I can just get work to stop long enough for me to enjoy this place god damn it!!!@#@!#!

[Pronoia]

The NGD forums are now what they are (deep and expressive eh?). For myself, I believe they should have been moderated closer to the state LFG is trying to achieve here, sans heavy moderation.

More specifically, if somebody posts that has no known predeliction for pie or other comestible, their post should be left the fuck alone to develop naturally.

The finest example of retard posting I have seen on the NGD forums recently was by the piece of rectal tissue that posted:

"We therefore are allowed to derail at will."

He was sat on by a mod and rightly so. Unfortunately that's the stickiest kind of shit that gets between your toes and is hard to remove. It cuts both way with hardcore types too. Communities are tarred with the same brush (or in this case, projectile monkey poo) and all communication becomes strained and tainted.

Hmm, I used the words rectal, shit and poo in the same (relatively short) post. People might start to think I'm fixated, so be it.

Pro.

[Pronoia]

Fwiw is an acronym for 'For What It's Worth'.

Oh, and just because I choose to post like a testosterone fuelled teenager doesn't necesarily mean I am. It just means that every now and then I get a kick out trash talking. I might be older than you think, or not.

[RadarX]

Rectal, shit, and poo....

God you are thinking like such an asshole....

I think you guys give far too much credit to a handful of people. NGD is not like it used to be, and any of us who've been around awhile can tell you that. What does it need? Good question, but it can't be compared to other forums.

[LFG]

Originally Posted by RadarX

I went ahead and pasted this so I could reply over here in the correct thread regarding it, because honestly that original thread was about an entirely different subject.

Do I understand your plight completely being comfortable in NGD? No, why would I? Do you understand how the NGD has worked over the last 18 months? I doubt it, and that's not an insult, that's just a statement of facts. I've got too much respect for some people to bullshit them, and while I disagree with things you say, I respect you. Plus I don't have the normal restrictions I have in the official forums.

1. Who cares who the mods are if they are doing the job? Hypothetically if you are correct in who the mods are...ok the are moderating the forums, so wouldn't people who are on the forums a lot be the people most likely to be able to moderate it? If they are around a lot anyways.... If they act professionaly as a moderator, when they are a moderator, I'm having a little trouble seeing issues. Now I have seen a some biased modding and believe me I've complained but you could select the most intelligent unbiased poster in the world and they would be an amazing mod all 4 hours a week. If what you say is true, they need people around 24/7.

2. I'll admit it can be hard to break into NGD if you don't understand what goes on. People can't expect to walk up to a group of other people and be accepted as a stranger. I wish I could tell you that it would be done. I personally try and be nice to people I don't recognize but people that post in an intelligent, non ranting manner are usually ok there.

3. Why would I deny it. This goes back to ummm they spend more time on the fourms than anyone else so why wouldn't they be given a little incentive for being around? It's a forum title... You don't see me coveting Khazan's 100% anti-dev do you? *shrug*

4. There was a self policing policy that was in affect for many many months. Most of you either don't remember or like to admit it, but NGD was a trashcan for buillshit whining about server downtime and customer service issues. The attitude is still there and I don't think they really have a mod that can properly handle NGD. It's supposed to be a fun place and no...it should be a little more relaxed because of that. Other areas of the forums are meant for feedback about game issues and derailments, flames, etc... create noise drowning that out. 90% of NGD *IS* noise.

5. I hate to make it like this but you know what? Raiding has nothing to do with modding a forum. If raiders (and yeah this is a blanket statement so don't get offended) could reduce the drama, stop getting so upset about things, and acting like a broken encounter will swallow Norrath up entirely maybe the mods wouldn't act like that. Broken stuff is valid. The method and drama a lot of raiders bring that to SOE's attention is childish and inmature. I read all over the forums, and you know I'm right about some of these posts. If you want to be called professionals, then all of you need to act like it (not pointing at you in particular by the way).

You shouldn't tell anyone to shut the hell up literally if they are wrong. You explain to them they are wrong within the RoC just like we have to do in NGD (and yeah we cross the line sometimes). Raiders tend to be very passionate about their subject and that boils over into anger which...well leads to the dark side. It has no place on those forums. I don't like raiding drama anymore than I like NGD drama.

I think the content of certain forums is a poor arguement for who should be a moderator. Should we get a crafter to moderate the crafting forum? How about a Templar for the Healer forums? It just seems going too far to me.

As I stated, I don't see it as a conflict of interest. The people that post a lot, know the forums better than others and would be more familiar with what is going too far and what isn't. And your example of them going in and playing mod in an arguement they are involved in? Clearly a conflict of interest and angers me greatly. I've seen Quassim lock a thread in the past to get that last word and sound tough so yeah it's pure bias. Who the moderators are seems to be of little consequence to me as long as they do their jobs correctly.

Wow that was lengthy...

Thank you for your thoughtful response. Sincerely.

I very much agree with your point about who cares who the mods are. I don't care except when it affects me. I'm actually sorry that all this information became public and caused grief for so many.

But, did SoE actually think this would remain secret forever? The EQ2 staff is populated by many smart and intelligent people. I struggle to understand why they didn't realize that it isn't the best idea to put foxes in charge of a hen house, as stated by the "soe inside" poster.

In my opinion, they should have made a rule for the mod program similar to the rule in the guide program. The guide program rule is that you can't serve as a guide on the same server as your regular characters. The mod rule should be that you can't post as a regular player in the same forums that you moderate. As far as I'm concerned, anything less is an unacceptable conflict of interest. If you want to be an infamous loudmouth like me, you should not be allowed to argue with people as a player, and then moderate them in an official capacity to win your argument. Even if anyone denies that was happening, it is the possibility and appearance of impropriety that creates a conflict of intererence. They teach these concepts in freshman college philosophy courses, why do they seem unknown at SoE?

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I hear you saying that mods should be allowed to post and moderate all forums. I think I also hear you saying that it is beneficial when a mod knows the people and subjects being discussed, because that helps them be a better mod. But I believe you are also saying that a basic familiarity with raiding issues has no relevance to moderating raiding discussions and raiders. I do not mean to put words in your mouth, but don't you see the inconsistency of that?

So NGD regulars who are mods should be allowed to moderate NGD, since that's a benefit, but there are no mods (except Gaige allegedly, and I don't know about that because we've never talked about it) who know the people and issues being discussed in the sections where people usually talked about raiding topics?

With the names outted in the first page of the other post, I ask you to look at something made easily possible by the EQ2 forum search tool. How does it make sense to you that the people named as mods, who were the most active modders in raiding posts, don't even have a level 70 character, or aren't in a raid guild? Honestly, that makes no sense to me at all, and I believe is inconsistent with your entire premise. They made frequent mod decisions about things they didn't understand, and that I just don't believe they would have made had they understood the issues being discussed.

BTW, I never had an issue with NGD having different rules than the other forums, per se. My problem was that I couldn't get that same deal with respect to a raiding forum where we could have hardcore serious discussions about raiding issues in the same manner that NGD posters could be equally hardcore about doing whatever it was that they did in NGD. I made three seperate requests for a raiding forum in the proper sections of the EQ2 forums. Two of those requests were ignored and disappeared into oblivion, one was specifically denied by Blackguard, who said he felt it wasn't needed.

It wasn't needed? Our discussions about technical raiding issues were being interrupted by people who don't have a high level character and have never raided, and we can't tell them they don't know what they are talking about without being moderated? Come on, that just isn't right.

In the end, I agree that SoE is a corporation and must moderate its forums. I never had a problem with that. But at the same time the new mods were put in place, the rules all seemed to become more strict, or at least much more strictly enforced. And then many of us felt that we no longer enjoyed the EQ2 forums, and felt suffocated when we tried to post there.