Wow how big of a tool is Grimwell - Page 11

Talonis · 02-21-2007, 05:09 PM

Ok....

If we can sheath the E-Peens for a sec, I think we got a real topic here.

High end raiders feed on WW 1st's. There is no argument there. An official atta-boy from the mothership to the wrong peeps is a fuckup. I personally don't think it defines the entire character or performance of Grimwell though. You are welcome to disagree.

We have all seen content released that was 'unbeatable in its current form'. We have also seen content that was thought to be too hard - until a motivated group of raiders killed it and the premise of encounter invincibility. We have also seen challenging encounters that were worthy of only the best of the best get training wheels attached after the flood of whine from inferior forces. These are all cases where getting the WW 1st is basically undisputed - by any rational thinking (Conspiracy theories, accusations, and outside help aside).

So the final case is where guild 'X' defeats mob 'Y'. The far from perfect devs admit to a buggy script, broken skill, etc, and make a 'fix' that essentially makes the encounter harder. So the question behind the flames here is this:

Does the guild that kills this ver 2.0 of the mob count as a first?

I personally say no. If you are badass enough to kill a harder mob, why didn't you kill the easier one?

First is first.

WW 1st says something about a raid force. They figured out the encounter, determined what skills were necessary to overcome problems faced by the encounter, and they executed it. FIRST. It is impossible to ever tell if guild 'X' that killed ver 2.0 had any help, tips, etc from previous kills that helped them. This info is certainly not news to the actual folks doing these feats, I just say it for the benefit of folks that may not understand the mindset of many *true* hardcore raiders. This is my rationale for feeling "ver 2.0 WW 1st's" are worth a little bit less than a Confederate dollar. Looks like I'm not alone in thinking this. What do you think?

Oh yeah, it is stupid-fucking-lame-Richard-Simmons-gay to claim someone else's credit and take advantage of an official outlet (however ill-conceived) to spread your bullshit twisted reality...... and come here with a crappy /shrug and defend your bucket of shit.

RadarX · 02-21-2007, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talonis

Ok....

If we can sheath the E-Peens for a sec, I think we got a real topic here.

High end raiders feed on WW 1st's. There is no argument there. An official atta-boy from the mothership to the wrong peeps is a fuckup. I personally don't think it defines the entire character or performance of Grimwell though. You are welcome to disagree.

We have all seen content released that was 'unbeatable in its current form'. We have also seen content that was thought to be too hard - until a motivated group of raiders killed it and the premise of encounter invincibility. We have also seen challenging encounters that were worthy of only the best of the best get training wheels attached after the flood of whine from inferior forces. These are all cases where getting the WW 1st is basically undisputed - by any rational thinking (Conspiracy theories, accusations, and outside help aside).

So the final case is where guild 'X' defeats mob 'Y'. The far from perfect devs admit to a buggy script, broken skill, etc, and make a 'fix' that essentially makes the encounter harder. So the question behind the flames here is this:

Does the guild that kills this ver 2.0 of the mob count as a first?

I personally say no. If you are badass enough to kill a harder mob, why didn't you kill the easier one?

First is first.

WW 1st says something about a raid force. They figured out the encounter, determined what skills were necessary to overcome problems faced by the encounter, and they executed it. FIRST. It is impossible to ever tell if guild 'X' that killed ver 2.0 had any help, tips, etc from previous kills that helped them. This info is certainly not news to the actual folks doing these feats, I just say it for the benefit of folks that may not understand the mindset of many *true* hardcore raiders. This is my rationale for feeling "ver 2.0 WW 1st's" are worth a little bit less than a Confederate dollar. Looks like I'm not alone in thinking this. What do you think?

See? Intelligent, mature, and straight to the point. If more people could do this, the raiding community would be taken a lot more seriously. THIS actually convinced me to change how I feel about WW1st's.

Take some notes Gaige.

LFG · 02-21-2007, 05:22 PM

Nice post Talonis.

arieste · 02-21-2007, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valanthe

WW1sting a fixed mob after someone beat the original version is like winning a gold medal in the Olympics because the true winner got popped on a drug test. It doesn't mean shit.

this implying that the person who cheats in the race should be recognised as the best runner in world as long as they didn't get caught in time for the ceremony?

EDIT: dont mean to imply that anyone cheated on any of the related mob kills, just talking about the surprisingly fitting analogy.

Levlelfe · 02-21-2007, 05:50 PM

Originally Posted by Valanthe

WW1sting a fixed mob after someone beat the original version is like winning a gold medal in the Olympics because the true winner got popped on a drug test. It doesn't mean shit.

The most ridiculous example i've seen on this post.

Tater · 02-21-2007, 06:06 PM

So why are you owning your self there bud, or did you edit it out

Nitestorm · 02-21-2007, 06:10 PM

Regardless, I just don't understand how you could even claim a WW 1st on any server for killing an Avatar if it is not fairly spawned. The whole subject should be dropped and taken off the frontpage of SOE. If everyone had a fair shot then it wouldn't be so mind boggling. Gratz on the kill!

Laodaron · 02-21-2007, 06:13 PM

I don't usually post alot about raiding, because it usually falls upon deaf ears to those that matter, but this is pretty ridiculous.

To state, up until this point, I've not noticed a whole lot bad about Grimwell. I've thought he's done a pretty nice job on the boards, and overall, I think that he's been a productive addition.

At this point, though, it has to be said, he's fucked up pretty bad. He's made a stand WITH Pandemonium, giving the big corporate gratz, and a stand AGAINST those who know it to be false.

He's like a news reporter reporting without reviewing the facts. That is career suicide in the journalistic world. You have to validate ALL information coming in.

There is nothing wrong with admission of being wrong, or making a mistake. I'd REALLY respect him if he stated he reviewed the logs, made a mistake, took some information given to him without checking its validity first, and posted. He recants, and congradulates SD on their WW1st.

That's all I have to say about it.

Levlelfe · 02-21-2007, 06:16 PM

SD never claim a ww1st on an specifik avatar, they just claim a first avatar kill ... that they got

We just say "on our website" that we ww1st valor in his current way .. we never say on EQ2flames or anywhere else that we have "really" the ww1st, coz we know that SD get it, we ever kill it 3 weeks ago and 7 days ago.

But, a mistake or not of our community representative or of Grimwell, that i insist we never be in contact with claim for us it.

We r proud of beeing the first guild that defeated it in his current form, but we never claim it by our own.

Nitestorm · 02-21-2007, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levlelfe

SD never claim a ww1st on an specifik avatar, they just claim a first avatar kill ... that they got

We just say "on our website" that we ww1st valor in his current way .. we never say on EQ2flames or anywhere else that we have "really" the ww1st, coz we know that SD get it

But, a mistake or not of our community representative or of Grimwell, that i insist we never be in contact with claim for us it.

We r proud of beeing the first guild that defeated it in his current form, but we never claim it by our own.

But, the whole issue here is that WW 1st means you kill it first no matter what state the mob is in when the game is released to the public. Because suposedly beta testers should have caught most of the bugs and the mob you are taking down is in correct working order. Which means they should retract there statement on SOE's site. Many mobs are always being changed on the live servers. Currently, Tarinax is a great example because it has been changed and it alllows nearly every guild to kill it at the moment. Before, he was not an easy kill. I am not saying that the Avatar was easy or harder in any way. Just pointing out like people have said in other posts. You could go kill any fixed mob after it is stated in the update notes and claim a WW 1st anytime. Which would defeat the whole purpose of WW 1sts.